Cycles

Published on February 25th, 2014 | by Jo Borrás

160

Elio Motors Reservations Hit 10,000

February 25th, 2014 by  
 

elio_main

Rather than making me feel better about the future of American manufacturing and forcing me to question my previously stated position on Elio Motors (in case you missed it, the short version is “not gonna happen”), every new press release out of Elio Motors makes me feel ickier and ickier about everything Elio.

Maybe it’s the constantly up-beat tone of the releases, despite the fact that they still haven’t delivered a single car and that the people who have seen the company’s self-released projections (and can do math) don’t seem to place much faith in them, and is hedging their bets accordingly. Or, maybe it’s the fact that Elio keeps using intentionally misleading terms like “supplier partners” when it refers to companies like Admiral Tool and Cooper Tires, falsely implying that these companies have some sort of special relationship with Elio. For Cooper’s part, they told me that “this partnership is not fundamentally different than other OEM partnerships” and explained that they sell tires to Elio, and they’d sell the same tires to your me at the same price for the same quantity when I inquired about their “partnership status” with Elio in a November 27th email.

It’s also worth noting that Elio’s people don’t respond to my emails at all. The one exception being an email about Gen. Wesley Clark, who they were courting as an investor.

In any event, 10,000 people have sent Elio their hard-earned cash so far. That number has risen sharply in recent months, ever since Elio Motors started offering refundable deposits- although they still give preferential treatment to those “true believers” who opt for non-refundable deposits in the form of additional discounts when if the cars ever get built. I say “if” based on a little math exercise I’d like you to follow along with, below:

  1. Elio had about 6,300 depositors at the end of last year (by their numbers)
  2. If Elio has 10,000 now, that means it’s had 3700 new deposits in about 50 days (10,000 – 6,300 = 3,700)
  3. 3700 / 50 = 74 new signatures per day
  4. Assuming Elio can carry that momentum forward, 74 “sales” x 365 days/year = 27,010 total sales

For those of you with long memories, 27,000 cars is just over a third of the 68,000 cars Elio Motors needs to sell in its first year for its self-released numbers to add up- and it’s only 11% of the 250,000 cars the company claims it will be able to sell, annually. That’s … well, it’s not a good sign for any company, and certainly not one that has 99% of the automotive media on its side, you know?

You know.

For what it’s worth, here’s the Elio Motors press release announcing their 10,000 deposits. Here’s sincerely hoping I’m wrong (it’s happened before), and every one of those 10,000 people gets something for their money.

 

Elio Motors Inc. Hits 10,000 Reservations for Aerodynamic, Enclosed 3-Wheel Vehicle

TROY, Mich. – Elio Motors announced that reservations for its aerodynamic, enclosed 3-wheel vehicle surpassed 10,000. The high level of interest is evidence that consumers are clamoring for an entirely new type of transportation option, according to Paul Elio, Founder and CEO of Elio Motors.

The vehicle, which is slated for production in 2015, will have a sticker price of $6,800.00, will achieve 84 miles per gallon fuel efficiency and is engineered to achieve a 5-star crash test safety rating. The vehicle is perfect for individual commuters looking for an inexpensive and fuel efficient mode of transportation, but who also yearn for a unique expression of their passion for driving.

“We’re not just creating a new vehicle,” Elio said. “We’re creating an entirely new industry segment that appeals to people who want a low-cost, highly efficient mode of transportation, but still want to own a unique vehicle that will turn some heads. The Elio gives people the best of both worlds. The fact that so many people have put their hands up and said ‘I want one’ tells me we’ve uncovered an underserved niche in the transportation industry.”

Elio has identified a number of customer segments that are perfect for the low-price, high-mileage 3-wheel vehicle, including

  • People who have large vehicles for family reasons, but find themselves driving to and from work without any passengers nearly every day;
  • College students who need a low-cost option for getting to and from campus;
  • Vacationers who want a second vehicle for running errands on weekends at the cottage;
  • Environmentalists who want to reduce carbon emissions;
  • People who want to see the United States reduce dependence on foreign oil;
  • Owners of low-mileage “clunkers” who would realize a net gain financially by purchasing one of Elio Motors’ vehicles.

    “It seems like every day we come across someone from a unique customer segment that sees how our vehicle easily fits into their lifestyle,” Elio said. “We see these initial 10,000 hand raisers as a great start in our journey to change how transportation is perceived in the United States. As more people see and hear about this vehicle, we expect reservations to continue to grow exponentially.”

    Reservations can be made at Eliomotors.com and range from $100 to $1,000. A non-refundable reservation provides customers with an additional discount worth 50 percent of the initial deposit (a $1,000 deposit would receive an additional $500 toward the price of a vehicle at the time of purchase). Although refundable deposits can be made, more than 80 percent of customers have opted for the non-refundable reservation, again reinforcing how strongly consumers feel about this vehicle.

    The Elio will come with standard features such as power windows, power door lock, tempered glass, three airbags, and an AM/FM radio. The vehicle will feature an eight gallon tank, which enables drivers to travel more than 670 miles without filling up and a Safety Management System comprised of reinforced roll-cage, Anti-Lock Braking System and 50 percent larger crush zones than a similar vehicle.

    Elio Motors’ supplier partners include Altair, IAV, Comau, NEWTECH 3, Cooper Tires, Irvin, Henkel, Admiral Tool, Technosports Creative, Cooper Standard, Dakkota Lighting Technologies, LLC, Detroit Thermal Systems, Eastern Catalytic, Guardian, Mando Corporation, Kiekert, Lear Corporation, Peterson Spring, Plastics Research Corporation, Superior Roll Forming and Takata.

    About Elio Motors: Founded by car enthusiast Paul Elio in 2008, Elio Motors Inc. represents a revolutionary approach to manufacturing an ultra-high-mileage vehicle. The 3-wheeled Elio will attain a highway mileage rating of more than 80 mpg while providing the comfort of power windows and air conditioning, accompanied by the safety of multiple air bags and an aerodynamic, enclosed vehicle body. Elio’s first manufacturing site will be in Shreveport, La., with plans for the first production vehicle to roll off the assembly line in 2015 and significant production, sales and distribution during the next two years.

Source | Photos: Elio Motors.





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About the Author

I've been involved in motorsports and tuning since 1997, and write for a number of blogs in the Important Media network. You can also find me on Twitter, or wandering aimlessly around Oak Park.



  • Jeff

    Why all the negativity? Do I smell an agenda?
    Naysayers didn’t give Colonel Sanders and Bill Gates a chance either.

    • That “negativity” you sense is objectivism. That “agenda” you smell is your own paranoid delusion.

      The other funny thing about your Col. Sanders/Bill Gates analogy is that you’re ignoring the hundred thousand or so restauranteurs and would-be software giants that did NOT become Ray Kroc, Steve Jobs, Wolfgang Puck, or Michael Dell.

      • Jeff

        So no one else should try because more people fail than succeed? Glad Tesla didn’t buy into such a defeatist attitude.

        • Not saying that, at all- but just because someone else succeeded doesn’t mean Elio will, and an objective reading of the business plan/projections they gave to the Caddo commissioners indicates they have no idea what they’re doing.

          Poor planning does not a sense of optimism engender.

          • Jeff

            This from a guy who blogs for a living?

          • LOL! +1 to Jeff. 🙂

          • Jeff

            Sorry to be shitty, but aren’t you glad people didn’t discourage you from blogging?
            If the Elio fails like Solyndra at least it won’t cost taxpayers 1/2 billion dollars.

          • That’s not s***ty at all, but you’re way off. I can think of maybe 3 people who have ever encouraged me to write anything at all- literally everyone, from parents to teachers to guidance counselors to employers to employees discouraged my writing career- both as a blogger and a novelist.

            As for Elio’s failure not costing taxpayers, who do you think bought him that big factory? He didn’t have a bake sale!

          • Jeff

            Elio worked out a deal to use a vacant GM factory (thanks Barack!) which will bring jobs and tax revenue to an otherwise empty building. If things don’t work out the plant will return to just another monument to Obama’s failed policies.

          • Elio worked out a deal to get the taxpayers of Shreveport to buy a factory, then lease it to him. As an empty building, the facility is worth millions in scrap copper and steel.

            As for your nonsensical Obama comments, ALL the GM plants would be empty without the government bailout of the company under his presidency.

            Those facts, along with your previous incoherent whining about unions in Elio’s Shreveport plant leave me wondering: Are you stupid, or just stupid?

          • Jeff

            “As for your nonsensical Obama comments, ALL the GM plants would be empty without the government bailout of the company under his presidency.”
            I call bullshit. Ford did just fine without the GM takeover/union bailout. But here again, it doesn’t fit your agenda does it?

          • Ford Motor Credit was bailed out to the tune of 15.9 BILLION US American dollars, kid. Have fun learning stuff: http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2010/12/report-ford-took-federal-funds-too.html

          • Did Jeff hang himself when he realized Ford to a bunch of bailout money? That’d be sad. He could have gotten mental help therapy under Obamacare.

          • Enjoy some reality.

          • Jeff

            Really? Just as I did when Obozo lied about “if you like your plan you can keep it”, and ” the attacks on Bengazi were the result of a video”, and “I didn’t know anything about the IRS targeting conservative groups”, and so on and so on, I will laugh at your ignorance.
            Sooner or later your Mom will kick you out of the basement and you will have to pay for your own internet access which will effectively shut down your “blog”

          • georgevoll22

            It’s Bush’s fault.

          • Truth-censoredbyliberals

            2013 GDP for the Year: 1.9%

            2012 GDP for the Year: 2.8%

            2011 GDP for the Year: 1.8%

            2010 GDP for the Year: 2.5%

            2009 GDP for the Year: -2.8%

            2008 GDP for the Year: -.03%

            2007 GDP for the Year: 1.8%

            The ideal GDP growth rate is one that is sustainable, so that it stays in the expansion phase of the business cycle as long as possible. GDP is the economy’s gross domestic product, which is the entire economic output for the past year. The GDP growth rate compares how much more (or less) the economy produced than the quarter before.

            A growth in GDP of 4% annually would be considered healthy. Healthy enough to be reflected job creation but not high enough to indicate an asset bubble.

            And speaking of bubbles, while I enjoy my S&P being up, I also know it is due to the Fed printing 75 billion a month to buy our own borrowing debt back. And NOT due to real GDP growth that wouldn’t be an artificial bubble like what we have now. Can you see another crash a coming when the plugs to the printers get pulled? I would desire more a stable and sustainable increase in the markets.

            But according to the congressional budget office official
            reports we haven’t had a single year that it’s been above 2.8%. While it’s not completely tanked, it is the slowest recovery since the Great Depression.

            In an Associated Press-GfK poll in January 2014, just 38% of those under 35 said they expected their financial situation to improve in the coming year, down from around half who said so through most of 2011 and 2012. That’s their seeing the results in real reality of this regimes policies. A “come to Jesus moment” for them.

            The gross manipulation of the unemployment rate due to the plunging labor force participation rate and the soaring, record number of people that are not in the labor force is by now, we hope, clear to all. Yes, millions may be dropping out of the labor force because they can’t find a job which somehow means the US economy is getting better, but sadly the US civilian, on-institutional population keeps rising, and hit an all time record 246.7 million in December 2013. Which is why every month we show what the real unemployment rate would look like when normalized for the fudged participation rate by taking a 30 year average.

            Today, we find that the difference between the reported (6.7%) unemployment rate, and the implied using realistic assumptions for the US labor force, which remained at 11.5% where it has been ever since the start of the Second Great Depression, just hit a record high 4.8%. As did the spin, lies and obfuscation by the administration that “all is well.”

            Oh dash it all with the actual substantiated facts…
            They keep getting in the way of liberal delusion and deliberate distortions to mislead the gullible with low information levels.

          • Bret

            Now you’ve done it for sure. Not only did you fill his liberal obfuscation of ‘so-called’ facts that were cut and pasted from a DemocRat site… you did it with facts of truth and explained them rationally and logically. And Jo isn’t comfortable with truth, facts or logic. What irrational and childish retort with another petty insult do you think he’ll post now? Good Job!

          • RIMSPOKE

            AHA ! THE CAT IS OUT OF THE BAG .

            I HAVE BEEN WONDERING FOR A YEAR WHY YOU HAVE BEEN WRITING THESE HIT PIECES ON THE ELIO .

            NOW I KNOW THE ANSWER , YOU’RE A POLITICAL HACK !

            ONLY SOMEONE WITH AN AXE TO GRIND WOULD DO SOMETHING DECEITFUL LIKE PRINTING MISINFORMATION .

            THE ELIO ISN’T ELECTRIC OR A HYBRID SO ESPECIALLY AT 84mpg , IT DOES NOT FIT OBAMA’s GREEN AGENDA .

            SORRY JO , YOU JUST SANK WAY DOWN ON MY OPINION METER

          • Syndi Torres

            LMAO BUSTED!

          • Syndi Torres

            My thoughts exactly Jeff 🙂

          • georgevoll22

            Hahaha, you are a robot blogger.

          • Indeed!

          • Syndi Torres

            OMG! You are such a HATER! Need a hug? lol

          • Knowing your s*** doesn’t make someone a hater, dear. Here’s what positive reviews on competent auto manufacturers look like. You might spot a distinct lack of hate. :: smooches ::

            http://gas2.org/2014/01/23/mitsubishi-outlander-review-4-states-1000-miles/

            http://gas2.org/2013/12/23/driving-the-2014-toyota-avalon-hybrid/

            http://gas2.org/2013/10/09/go-texas-honda-part-3-50-mpg-accord/

        • Syndi Torres

          Exactly!

      • Syndi Torres

        Could you have been an “Auto Designer Giant” and failed? Is this why all the “HATER” Blogging??? Hmmmm….I’m I close? Sounds personal!

    • Harley

      obvious troll is obvious. don’t feed the trolls.

      • Syndi Torres

        Jeff & Harley this “Troll” wrote a “Hater” article about Elio…..lol..He’s jealous he didn’t come up with the idea himself! ha ha

  • Umm, the Elio vehicle has 3 wheels.

    Their progress is about where Aptera got to, though Elio has many more deposits, and they have an actual factory building and a more public plan. We can hope that Elio produces this vehicle and that it shakes things up – if they do this, then they will have succeeded.

    We’ll see what happens.

    • Oh, 100%! If they pull this off, it’ll be HUGE … it’s the scope of what they’re trying to accomplish, however, that makes me think they’re nuts.

    • 1 more thing: “2 wheels” is just what we called our motorcycle category. The Elio is classified a motorcycle, so this is where it goes.

      • Okay, got it!

      • Syndi Torres

        Elio vehicle has been reported to have “3” wheels, not “2”. One in the back and two in the front….

    • Syndi Torres

      Best of Luck & GOD SPEED ELIO!

  • erikgrad

    So many have others have put together plans for these automotive startups: CODA, Carbon Motors, Aptera, etc… It seems that when they reach the point of production obligation, they suddenly fold, and it becomes apparent they never had an organized production plan in the first place (well, in fairness, CODA did). Vaporware. I badly want to see one of these companies succeed…but I have seen enough pie-in-the-sky promises that I know we have to remain skeptical. Elio Motors should have put this at a price point about $2k higher, dropped the MPG estimate 25-35%. Instead of saying that the car would have a 5 star crash rating, say it would be on par with or beat the subcompact vehicles on the market today. Even if they gone with those less optimistic promises, they would still have plenty of deposits…and they leave themselves room to exceed the market expectations. With an extra 29% on the vehicle price, their break even point would be much lower than 68,000 units – probably still not enough, though. Look at the Model S, another revolutionary vehicle, albeit with a much higher price tag. It’s Tesla’s second product offering after the very limited run Roadster, so it isn’t their first dance. Despite all of the publicity and press surrounding the product, (and an almost ‘bottomless pocket’ investor in Elon Musk), they’ve sold about 27,000 units to date from 2012 to now. Their projections are to sell about 35,000 units this year. The only way I can foresee Elio succeeding is if they can find a partner in a major automaker (who is willing to invest at a loss, short term) and are able to raid said automaker’s parts bin to build the product. Why would an automaker do that? I have no idea…they would have to have deep pockets, yet be desperate, and fully willing to potentially cannibalize sales of their subcompact market.

    • One of these companies did succeed. It’s called Tesla, and it wasn’t even a thing 10 years ago.

      • georgevoll22

        Tesla only survived because of ZEV credits.

        • egogg

          And aren’t you proud they did. Their stock price is soaring, and they’ve paid back all of their startup loans. They make the best vehicle in the world, right here in the USA.

  • daibutsu

    I’m a minor ‘investor,’ I of course would love to see Elio succeed. I admit that their email response time is dismal and even when answered didn’t address the original question. My ‘antennae’ go up and down but now are mostly up after Elio tried to sell us, those already committed, a cheesy St. Patrick’s Day tee shirt for 25 bucks…. It makes me concerned that marketing will be a lynch pin in their strategy… also there are reports that there is nothing happening at the Caddo Parish LA plant.

    • That may be good for Caddo Parrish, who is hedging their bets on Elio: http://gas2.org/2013/09/08/is-caddo-parish-going-to-demolish-the-elio-motors-factory/

      • daibutsu

        It is apparent to me that your interest in Elio and their business plan, and therefore the ostensible ‘news’ value in your blog/article, is much more than merely objective.

        • You may need to look up the word “apparent”. It is “apparent” to me that you want your investment to yield a return. While I hope it does, to some extent, I’m much more concerned about the 10,000+ “true believers” out there who are hoping for jobs, hoping to rebuild their community, and hoping to find a new, reliable, and safe alternative for of transportation.

          I don’t think Elio Motors will deliver on any of those things, however, and I base that on an objective reading of their laughable “plan” to sell 250,000 units/year.

          • daibutsu

            Jo Borras says:

            “You may need to look up the word “apparent”. It is “apparent” to me that you want your investment to yield a return….”

            I’m not a writer, please excuse me. You “apparently” believe you are and Gas 2.0 has given you a soapbox; i hope you are a principal in Gas 2.0 because you should not represent them. Maybe some one else will forward this around to further illustrate your shortcomings.

          • I’m trying to find some sort of compassion for you and your investment here, but you’re making it really easy for me to hope the whole mess crashes and burns.

            Have fun getting fleeced.

          • daibutsu

            Jo adds:

            “I’m trying to find some sort of compassion for you and your investment here, but you’re making it really easy for me to hope the whole mess crashes and burns.
            Have fun getting fleeced.”

            Well, I guess this shows the objective nature of articles within Gas 2.0….it does look like every article is penned by this loser. you should reflect on this if you see other ‘news’ on other sites penned by this ‘author.’

          • Don’t mistake my desire to see you, personally, get fleeced with a desire to see 10,000 innocent victims get fleeced. You come across as a _______, whereas most of them probably just hope Elio succeeds so they can have a job or be able to afford a new vehicle for the first time in their lives.

          • daibutsu

            A little too late to backpedal there, Skippy. If i get fleeced so do all the others. You are in the wrong profession, me thinks.

          • I don’t think you know what “backpedalling” means, either.

          • egogg

            Shall we presume ________ = Shitbag? Ok, I’ll do that.

          • HA! No, but I figured the people reading would come up with something good. Looks like I was right!!

  • Harley

    Jo, I posted a comment on your last article after reviewing
    several, but never got a response.

    Harley • a month
    ago

    “Jo, I just caught wind of the Elio from the CES trade show,
    and have since been researching with interest. I’ve enjoyed your critical
    commentary, although I question your criticism of the base concept considering
    that Toyota
    also unveiled a similar concept in an electric variant called the iRoad. If the
    concept was fundamentally flawed, I have a hard time accepting that a major
    automotive manufacturer like Toyota
    would follow suite.”

    So what about the “iRoad” concept that seems to be following
    Elio’s lead?

    • I have no issue with the Elio as a vehicle/concept. The difference I see is in each company’s approach to the market.

      Toyota is an established industry giant that employs over 360,000 Americans, has 1500 nationwide dealers, and years of establishing itself as a reliable product to its customers and competitors.

      When it comes to the similar-in-concept iRoad, Toyota is looking to produce dozens, maybe hundreds of the things in its home “city”, primarily for use by its workforce to commute to and fro. Toyota doesn’t think the iRoad has the same kind of potential for success as its Corolla or Yaris models, and has no illusions about selling 250,000 units/year (as Elio claims it will), or even 25000 units (as Elio maybe could, given a few years).

      Now, here comes Elio. A guy with no proprietary technology (the engine in his prototype is from a 1990s Geo), no existing dealer network, and no finished product, who claims that there is a huge, pent-up demand for a vehicle like this, to the tune of 250,000 units/year … and THAT out of a national dealer network that, even if it existed in exactly the way Elio’s Utopian projections would imply, is only a fraction of the size of Toyota’s (or GM’s, or Honda’s, or Volvo’s for chrissakes!).

      To me, those are huge differences.

  • Tim Cleland

    Although I’m not an investor, I can’t help but root for Elio. I think your projection of 74 sales per day is flawed. I’m not going to put down a deposit (even a refundable one), but I’m very interested in purchasing one if they ever come to market. I’d want to test-drive one before I even think about purchasing. Similarly, I think there will be a lot of people that, once they would start seeing them on the road, would start researching them and get really interested. If they can hold anywhere near that purchase price (even $1000-1500 more) and mpg rating (or even 10-15 mpg less), they’ve got a winner.

    But I do agree with you that skepticism is probably the best bet right now, unfortunately.

    • It’s not a “projection”, it’s the rate at which Elio claims to be adding reservations.

      • Tim Cleland

        Oh, I understood your reasoning, but I disagree with your use of the figures from their reservations as a projection into future sales. Actual production, if it ever occurs, would bring in an entirely different demographic of customers (rather than just hopeful internet fans and hypesters).

        • Yes- and probably quite a few less. Remember, having a reservation does not mean you’ll get financed on a new Elio (especially if it goes ahead as a motorcycle). How many of the reservation holders will drop off when faced with a $5800 balance on their new Elio? 20%? 50%?

  • Mxpctlk

    I’ve been following Elio for about 9 months, watching and listening carefully. I’ve gone from being an optimistic hopeful ready to plunk down a deposit — to becoming a skeptic.

    • There’s always the “refundable deposit” option.

      • Mxpctlk

        Anecdotes indicate their financial position is as outlined earlier here. If that’s the case, it would be unlikely one would recoup a deposit in event of failure. Think I’ll just wait and see where this goes.

        • That depends on how they treat the reservation. If it’s in a standard escrow account or backed by some insurance policy, I’m sure they’ll be able to cover it … care to email them and ask? They haven’t responded to me.

          • Mxpctlk

            I’d say you got your answer in their non-response.

  • J Nutbolt

    Last November I talked to Elio Motors Marketing Team at Henderson
    mall and he said they were only taking reservations up to half their 1st
    year production goal. That would be 34,000 reservations total.

    1. 6300/365 = 17 reservations per day average in 2013

    2. 74 reservations average in 1st 50 days of the year. That’s over 4 times the average per day compared to last year in the 1st two months of the year.

    3. Conservatively if they just doubled that average after June .

    1st 6 month average at 74 per day = 13,505

    Last 6 months average at 148 per day = 27,010

    40,515 (2014) + 6300 (2013) = 46,815

    Even with my conservative numbers they would
    still surpass there goal by 12,000 reservations

    • I don’t think those 6300 reservations were just in 2013, though- the company has been trying to make a go of things since 2008. That’s a good point, though.

      Anyone know when Elio started taking reservations?

      PS
      No one with any kind of business experience would call a 100% increase “conservative”, but if your numbers hold up then I’d tend to agree with you.

      • J Nutbolt

        Elio opened reservations in January 2013 granted i’m sure there were many followers waiting for reservations to open up.
        I based the 100% on trend, picking that number as an average over 6 months. I’m sure some months will be better than others. Also the high increase in January and February could be due to CES and Film festival.
        I think the demand is there at least for the 1st year. 2nd year goal seems high. Hopfully they wont run out of money.
        Time will tell.

        • If that’s the plan, then I’d say you were right!

  • MrKevinSD

    Aptera 2.0

  • egogg

    What is it about startups that makes people foam at the mouth? Jeebus, it’s usually so quiet on this blog.

    • It’s this one more than any other, too. I think it’s because of all the “we’re gonna git back yer jobs!” rhetoric coming from Elio PR.

      • Jeff

        Rhetoric or fact? The GM plant he wants to use was closed. What is wrong with jobs, tax revenue where there is none, and a product that people want?
        Oh that’s right, there is that whole agenda thingy.

  • Jeff

    As long as Elio keeps the union thugs away this will succeed. The only haters out there are those that prefer alternatives to the combustion engine. I would have thought 84 miles per gallon would make the greenie weenies happy but alas it’s all an agenda.

    • Huh!? This is so nutty I can’t even follow it.

      You might have something with the unions, but the workers Elio intends to hire back at the old GM plant will all still be UAW members, so … yeah, the unions are already there.

      As for 84 MPG, that’s 84 claimed MPG. He still hasn’t built a car or had it EPA tested. Could all be hype. Could be a lowball number. We won’t know until the company starts production in 2015 … if it does, rather.

      • Jeff

        The idea of this gas engine driven vehicle scares the crap out of greenie weenie’s. The failure of the green movement, the exposure of the global warming lie is just too much for some to accept. It’s ok, we understand you were lied to and fell for it hook, line, and sinker. From now on though you are responsible for your own actions. You are the robot they wanted you to be.

        • I’m a robot? OMG … you’re right! I’M A F***ING ROBOT MOTHERF***ERS! WOOOOT!!!

          Also: Jeff is still stupid.

          • Jeff

            Jeff is still stupid?
            You might want to apply for a job at MSNBC.

          • egogg

            Dude, you should apply for a job eating lead paint chips. You showed such talent for it as a child.

          • LOL! I can’t believe I left this thread 2 days ago and missed this!

        • egogg

          Gas cars scare “greenies” eh? You should get out of your cold-war era bomb shelter sometime. All of you fox news guzzling, 50-something, balding, white, racist, woman-hating, gun-toting religitards are going the way of the dodo anyway. How do you like being pigeonholed?

          • Bret

            And the Green movement that has deliberately created a man made killing drought in the largest, most fertile food producing land in California to protect a smelt is the brilliance from the left? While food prices soar and people struggle to pay for food.

            Shutting down the coal industry that supplies almost 40% of the nations supply of energy is logical? When there is no logical replacement source of energy of that magnitude at this time.

            Demanding that cars use more and more ethanol in fuel, when it’s production creates a larger greenhouse gases footprint that using 100% gas is green genius? Al Gore even admitted he lied about ethanol because he needed the Iowa and corn growing states votes. And people could use the same farmland for edible corn to fight world hunger and feed livestock for more food.

            All you MSNBC drones, HoMo hugging, illegal alien loving, ‘all my ancestors were apes’, “we don’t need no good paying full time production jobs, when we got food stamps, welfare checks, section 8 housing, and taxpayer subsidized ObamaDontCare” “we can stay home and watch TV all day and let those bad old conservatives pay all the taxes for us”.

            You Libaroids will make America into being another Rhodesia becoming Zimbabwe, just like you did to Detroit. Dead broke, starving and totally clueess what to do about it, but you’ll blame us for all YOUR mistakes, like always!
            How do you like being pigeonholed?

          • egogg

            I worked in the control room of a coal fired power plant for years. I don’t need a lecture on how wonderful coal is. It’s not.

          • Bret

            I worked as a utilities engineer in coal fired, natural gas, nuclear with oil fire backed energy plants for over a quarter century. Not everyone has the luxury of owning a home (rather than rent) with a garage or a carport where they can plug in an electric vehicle and add to the greenhouse gas foot print recharging it.
            Most of us live in the real world. The one where you need a vehicle that can go more than a 100 mile limit before refueling for hours.
            How’s that for a real world reality check?

          • egogg

            Most families have multiple cars. I have the EV, a Subaru and a motorcycle. I rent; I charge level 1 at my house, and there’s a public level 2 charger where I work. EV’s aren’t Marxism-mobiles; my EV saves me a lot of money, and prevents my money from indirectly funding countries like Saudi Arabia, Iran and Venezuela.

          • Bret

            Well all that is great for you… but what about the other 99% of America? What about those who can only afford one vehicle?
            I own several myself, but I know many that only have one.

            So you think they should all use a vehicle that can only do 85-125 miles at the most, before needing a multiple hour recharge (and just anywhere they want to plug in)? REALLY?
            It’s just NOT feasible… period! Making the internal combustible engine vehicle more efficient is. Offering a diesel or CNG engine vehicle is. Even a hybrid gas electric/gas engine is. But until you can create an all electric vehicle that can do 700+ miles without a recharge, and furnish a legitimate place to get a recharge (wherever you want) … Then you are just being totally ludicrous in your rationality.

            And I suppose you actually believe your electrical recharge comes magically from somewhere that doesn’t use some fossil fuels to make that happen for you.

            Did you rent a unicorn for your daughters birthday party?

          • egogg

            Way to ignore my cited source. I have no interest in arguing past you.

          • Bret

            Way to ignore that electric vehicles are nothing but an impractical
            eco-snob’s ego gadget. And they have very limited use and mileage which
            requires unique recharging stations. While requiring very lengthy
            recharging periods, to their dangerously fire hazard prone and expensive eco-toxic large lithium battery banks.

            Not
            to mention that the source of most (if not all) their energy comes from fossil
            fuel plants which negates all of the eco-snob’s “Hey look at me, I’m green, I
            love that tree over there”, “I don’t have a big carbon foot print” – snob attitude!

            Of course you won’t argue, you lost the argument, because everything I stated you know is true, and you have no logical counterpoint with which to prove me wrong with. So I win!

          • Whenever a comment goes past 500 words, I just assume the poster is a nut.

            Also, I assume you don’t win many things, if you think that’s what a win looks like.

          • Bret

            Just as I thought and suspected. If you never read nor accept anything over 500 words. It’s likely you’ve never read enough to do adequate research for your narrow minded opinion posts. Am I surprised? NO! Am I amused? Yes, that I was indeed right again.

          • More than 50% of US households have more than 1 car, actually. That’s a pretty accurate number to base “most” on. As for 85-125 miles, yeah- I’d say the majority of people don’t drive anywhere near that far on a given day, and have the required 2-4 hours, once they get 125 miles from where they started, to recharge.

            Since you don’t seem to know about the Superchargers and other tech that already exists and allows 10-30 minute recharges, I won’t tell you about them. That said, you seem a bit out of touch with reality.

            Maybe that’s YOUR reality, but the rest of us live in a different one.

            https://people.hofstra.edu/geotrans/eng/ch6en/conc6en/USAownershipcars.html

          • egogg

            I don’t understand exactly how people can be so closed minded. But yeah, I done arguing. EV’s work fine for me, and as more people buy them, they’ll work fine for other people too.

          • Bret

            So supercharger stations are as abundant as gas stations.
            Gee I didn’t know that. Maybe because they AREN’T!
            And if 50% of households own more than one vehicle, then it would also go to reason the other 50% don’t or own more than two. Actually your figures are off the number owning more than one is higher by almost 15%. But I don’t trust your opinions based on your numbers anyway.
            I think you skew them to try and make a point.
            Now approximately 95% of car commuters in the U.S. travel less than 40 miles one way to work the other 5% drive up to 70 or 80 miles one way to work. So your charge level will be depleted or near depletion by the both way trips. Unless your employer allows you a recharge or you have a “supercharger” station on the way.
            Now there are those who use their vehicle as a part of their job. My brother is a good example, as he travels daily to meet clients all over the region and drives well over 100 miles a day not including his commute. An EV would likely not be practical. Even if the increased cost made it possible for the company. to offer one as a fleet vehicle.

          • c whittle

            Right Jeff….this country is turning to the shithole you just described and non working folks just want to eat, sleep and fuck….

          • Knuckles Mutatis

            No offense, but I can tell from how you talk that you’ve been getting ideas from fox news, and it’s clear that you don’t know a thing about Detroit and the big three. If you did, you’d know that while about 600,000 live in Detroit, over 3.5 million live in the surrounding metro-area, and huge sections of that metro-area are rather well-off (in fact, Oakland County is still in the top 10 richest Counties in America with over 1 million people). Next, the vast majority of the big 3 factories are NOT in Detroit at all, but in those surrounding cities. Next, those cities are both democrat or republican, and these factories are in both. Next, doing factory work these plants pays $14/hour, which is actually $2/hr less than Toyota & Honda, though you have better representation going with a union.

            The Detroit area is absolutely nothing like republicans think at all. Stop blindly believing what is spoon-fed to you on right-wing TV.

          • Bret

            Well Knuckles-head I did take offense…

            Assuming I had no personal knowledge about Detroit and it’s condition and how it has declined.

            That’s where your wrong! You see I was an expedite truck driver who drove primarily 90%+ to auto plants all over the eastern half of the country. I delivered parts from suppliers to them and dealt with every makers plants of autos there is in the eastern U.S.

            I witnessed the decay and fall of Detroit and I know who was directly responsible for it. 1. 50 years of liberal corrupt DemocRat politicians and 2.Over paid greedy, and spoiled lazy labor unions.

            I witnessed plants that worked efficiently, they were clean and modern, and operated around the clock at full tilt.

            Deliveries were quick and transfer of parts went to the points on the assembly line where they were needed immediately.

            The employees were quite polite and congenial and when I asked, they said they loved their job and employer.

            But all these were outside the rust belt, except for the Honda plant in Ohio.

            Then I saw old, decaying plants where the production lines were unefficient and the receiving docks shut down for mid morning and mid afternoon breaks for 30 minutes each at a time. Everyone goes to break at the same time.
            No 50/50 split to keep operations running.( by union agreements).
            Thus holding up an expensive expedited delivery of badly needed crucial parts for the assembly line in order to NOT shutdown costing the company a fortune in down time..

            These same companies paid employees while they went on strike. They paid them even when they were laid off. (by union agreements).

            The employees there were rude, had a universal state of malaise about themselves. And they had most lacking of a work ethic to do a job. More like ‘I only do so much a day and that’s it…period’ (even though I’m still on the clock) attitude.

            I didn’t need to get anything about Detroit and the surrounding area from Fox News. It was all quite apparent just going there time and time again and seeing it for myself.

            But even the GM plants at Warren, Flint, Ypsilanti and Lansing were just as bad as the one in Hamtramck.

            Many are now closed and it’s no real wonder why.

            The wonder is how they didn’t close earlier than they did.

            Ford and Chrysler were bad, just not as bad. Could be why GM needed a bailout, Chrysler too but Ford squeaked by without.

            Yes I know Detroit gets worse south of 8 mile road than above it. But that is like saying ‘well the south side of Chicago is different from t.he north side.

            One doesn’t need to examine each and every rotten apple in a keg, when the first half you’ve examined shows that 75% are rotten. You’ll know you have a bad keg of apples.

            And when you read an article in the The Detroit News that has a headline of ‘Even the dead are moving out of Detroit’ which goes on to say that relatives of the deceased are moving their loved ones remains out of the metro city cemetaries, because it’s no longer safe to go and place flowers on their gravesites due to gang warfare and drive by shootings. Detroit’s population has declined from a peak of 1.8 million in 1950; and recently, the New York Times called the city “home to 700,000 people, as well as to tens of thousands of abandoned buildings, vacant lots and unlit streets. (New York Times (THe Slimes) is no ‘right wing’ newspaper either.

            No, I think my assessment is valid from the evidence I was given. Then there is that Chapter 9 bankruptcy at $18–20 billion… yeah that’s a REAL sticker shock. I got it spot on…

      • Truth-censoredbyliberals

        Well Jo since they aren’t answering your email, I’ll generously share one with you, to me from them. Maybe that way you’ll have something to comment on besides just your opinions.

        That will be good, because then you’ll know what you’re talking about.

        Oh by the way they have built at least 4 working prototypes and they are preparing for the government Federal crash testing.

        Engine Q&A with IAV – 2-21-14
        by eliomotors

        A fantastic Friday to all of our Elio friends and fans. This was an
        exciting week for everyone involved as we crossed the 10,000 reservation plateau. This is the true definition of a team effort as we couldn’t have achieved this without you! This is just one step of our journey as we move on to bigger and better places. How high can we take this?
        25,000? 50,000? Together anything is possible!

        Last week we answered many of the most popular questions that have come our way. Many of you wondered why we didn’t answer any on the engine. All as done by design because we knew that this week we had the guru when it comes to the Elio/IAV engine, Kody, the Project Director for the Elio/IAV powertrain. Here we go:

        Q. Let’s start off with an easy one: What type of oil will the engine take? Can we use synthetic oil?

        The oil that is currently specified for the engine is 5w 20, a standard motor oil. As for synthetic, those specs will have to follow as we are working with our oil partner to find the right blend for our engine.
        Oh, and the change interval for the oil will be just like most
        automotive engines, 3,000 miles.

        Q. What type of fuel injection will the Elio/IAV engine have?

        Our engine will be designed with sequential port fuel injection as a fuel delivery method. This allows us to control the fuel usage more
        accurately which leads to the outstanding gas mileage that we will
        achieve, 84 mpg on the highway.

        Q. Are we going to use a timing chain or belt?

        The all-aluminum, liquid cooled Elio engine will use a timing chain. We chose to go with the timing chain because of durability.

        Q. What is the final horsepower rating going to be?

        The current spec for the horsepower is 55. We do have the ability,
        however, to move that number either up (over 60hp) or down to achieve our goal of 84 mpg highway. As our latest prototype with our motor achieved 81.4 mpg on a test track.
        The fine tuning of the engine performance curve is in process now to ensure that we hit the targeted 84 mpg highway.

        Q. Finally, what air filter will be used and can it be replaced with a performance filter?

        The air filter for the Elio engine will be an “off the shelf” solution
        keeping in concert with the overall strategy of using existing parts
        where we can. As for a performance air filter, yes, you will be able to use them if you would like.

        Thanks again to all of you for your support. 10K is a great stepping stone on our way to changing the way you move!

        • Truth-censoredbyliberals

          Here is another e-mail that “they never send” discussing the tour stops using 2 0r the 4 prototypes or “not one single vehicle they ever built”.

          Elio Preview Tour 3-1-14
          by eliomotors

          Happy March Elio’ers, we are one month closer to changing the way you move!

          Itis time for the Elio to hit the road again! We are kicking off our 2014 Preview Tour starting next week. If you can, make sure that you come out and see it live. It is way better in person! And, in case you are wondering, and we know that you are, the tour is for getting a feel for the vehicle – sit in it, walk around it to see if it will fit in your garage (Yes!), and overall just take it all in. This is also a great way to get your questions answered and meet some of the great team behind Elio Motors. We strongly encourage you to take pictures and share them on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Pinterest, or go old school and actually carry the picture around and show it to people. Will we do test drives, not just yet because this is a hand-built prototype, one-of-one, which we treat better than we treat ourselves. Test drives will come as we get closer to production.

          Many have asked how we choose the cities and events for the stops. There is a “master plan” that the team has been working towards but with some flexibility built-in. Last year we hit markets 1 through 30 of the Top 60 markets in the US (plus a couple of bonus stops). The Top 60 markets are those markets where we anticipate having an Elio dealership. Did you catch the connection?

          This year’s tour started off fast and furious (as we have written about in prior blogs). The tour continues this week with a quick private stop in Washington DC and then we hit the road again! We are expanding our target to include the second 30 of the top 60 markets and more major public events. One of our first stops fits this perfectly – Daytona Beach, Florida for Daytona Bike Week! We are really looking forward to Bike Week, come and say “hello” if you are in the area!

          We are going to start the next phase of the tour using two vehicles when we have multiple events to attend- the Rocket Silver P3 and the Creamsicle P4. We have decided to use both prototypes, when needed, to make sure that we get to all large events and allow even more of our fans and “pre-fans” to experience the Elio. Regardless of which prototype that you see, they both will allow you to get a great feel for what the vehicle is and what it will become. Here is a look at where we have been so far (green) and where we are going in the next couple ofweeks (orange):

          Please continue to watch the website for changes and additions to the tour!

          We are also planning on some “bonus” stops between tour and event locations. These will be informal events held at hotels along the way to our next event. These stops will be communicated through the website (under the News tab) so keep checking back!

          March is going to be another great month. Thanks for your continued support!

          Early March Tour Stops:

          March 4th – Knoxville, TN – 3 pm to 7pm – Hilton Knoxville Airport – McGee Tyson Airport – 2001 Alcoa Hwy, Alcoa, TN 37701

          March 6th – Phoenix, Arizona – 10am to 2pm – Arizona Capital Showing, 1700 West Washington Street, Phoenix, AZ

          March 7th – 16th – Daytona Beach, Florida – Daytona Bike Week; We will be at 405 Main Street, Daytona Beach, FL (Tombstone Silverworks building)

          March 17th and 18th – Savannah, Georgia
          – March 17th – St. Patty’s Day Parade Area – March 18th, 3-7pm,
          Embassy Suites Airport – 145 W. Mulberry Blvd (Exit 104), Savannah, Georgia

      • Truth-censoredbyliberals

        “Elio intends to hire back at the old GM plant will all still be UAW members, so … yeah, the unions are already there.”
        Actually No and No. While Elio is planning on hiring from the banks of the unemployed skilled workers (ex-GM or not)… the fact they may once have worked at old defunct GM plant for GM that had an old contract with the UAW, doesn’t obligate Elio to honor another companies contract with a union.
        So NO, they would necessitate another unionization vote and work out an entirely new contract between the two.
        Having had a seat on the union board of contract negotiators working for a company that changed management contractors 4 times in twenty five years. So, I know that to be a fact. However it is possible for a new company to honor and old contract if they chose to do so where the old company never in effect shut down the facility and dismissed the workers..
        Had you been listening back when GM and Chrysler got their Government bailouts… you would have head DemocRats express the fact that if those companies went bankrupt and new company investors bought them out, the old contracts would become void under bankruptcy. So once again you are talking about something you know nothing about.

  • Truth-censoredbyliberals

    Sorry to hear they don’t answer your e-mails Mr. Jo Borrás.
    But I’ve been in contact with them multiple times via email. And they always answer my questions, listen to suggestions and reply with personal interaction. In fact they are coming March 4th to my town to display their prototype and I’m cooperating letting local press, TV news and radio talk show host know, and they (Elio sales reps) responded in a kind personal e-mail thanking me.
    Might I suggest, less of the ‘nay saying’, deliberate, verbal sabotage. And just follow a story with an unbiased view when reporting. Let things progress as they may or not, without your interjecting your vitriol into the commentary. You can be objective without constant negative prejudice… it’s called real journalism. Just do that… and
    they may reply to you then.

    • So, following the story without critical thinking, repeating everything they say, and staying positive is your version of “unbiased”? LOL!

      (that means “laughing out loud” … I am laughing at you)

      • Bret

        Ever run a start up company? Ever design a completely new automobile or vehicle for mass production and follow through with multiple working prototypes starting from scratch? Ever had to seek multimillion dollar financing for start up? And succeed in acquiring access to a modern factory-plant facilities to go into mass production?
        Because you post like you have, and you know all about it.
        But I doubt your credentials are valid to make an intelligent opine on the subject from your own experiences.

        Being “involved in motorsports and tuning” for 15 even twenty years, isn’t qualifications and sufficient to even attempt any of that.

        Your entitled to your opinion, but that is all it is, your opinion.
        And insulting someone because they offered you a different opinion based on their different experience with Elio, shows your immaturity and narrow mindedness, to even being able to objectively look at yourself much less anyone else.

        • Truth-censoredbyliberals

          Thanks Bret, I was just relating my email experience with Elio which has been plentiful, imformative and usually prompt or at least timely. And I merely pointed out his boorish negativity might be reflected in his emails just as it is in his lack luster so-called informational posts. With as much emails as they must get, ignoring a ‘subjective to negativity’ one, might be just being prudent with your time and efforts in answering many communications.

          And of course Jo Borras, true to form, shows his immature boorish nature with a petty insult like a childish little piker that he is.

          • INB4 I should change my name to Jo Booras. LOL

          • Truth-censoredbyliberals

            Maybe you should, or at least make some attempt to have your facts right and make a point in your blogs. It will make whatever you have to say so much more interesting to read.
            And a little less petty sarcasm and insults would give some the illusion that you might be almost as smart as you think you are.

          • Upsetting the conservitards is how I know I’m right, tho.

          • Truth-censoredbyliberals

            By proving yourself to be a blowhard moron is why we’re glad you’re not a conservative,Joe Boreass
            Maybe like Nancy Pelosi you should learn to read something (like do some research) before you post it.

        • Actually, I have. Read bios, search Google, quit yappin’. 🙂

          • Bret

            Well by the immature content of your retorts, to their informed posts… I think they did. And I’ll go further with my perception… I’d venture to guess that Truth-censoredbyliberals has about 40 to 50 points more on the IQ scale than yourself.
            And they have something you totally lack, that being polite and tactful commentary. As it all definitely shows.

          • Truth-censoredbyliberals

            Thanks again for the compliment Bret, and may I add very well said indeed sir! It’s always a pleasure to read a post with intellectual incite for a change… as opposed to useless drivel.

          • Nobody who thinks the liberals are actively censoring them has 40 to 50 IQ points, let alone 40 or 50 IQ points “over” someone else. <3

          • Bret

            Well Jo Boreass, your opinion is just that an opinion, but not worth very much at all. So maybe you should rename your clueless and useless blog ‘My Gas’.
            As that’s all you are expelling smelly, worthless gas.
            Since this post I have actually have seen and sat in a running Elio in my hometown. You know the vehicle you said “they had not made one of yet”. And now the reservations are up to 13,000 and growing.
            And by the way I too am getting e-mail responses from Elio on questions asked, about twice a week.
            Perhaps if you weren’t the know-nothing pompous jerk-ass
            that you are… they might reply to you.
            And yes, now not only do I think truth is smarter than you, I am convinced myself and my dog are smarter than you.
            As my dog knows not to cosume his one shit he puts out.
            But that isn’t bragging, as cretinous morons like yourself can’t be held accountable for their lack of intellect.

      • kneesus

        You’re kind of full of yourself but I can give you better ammo than what you have. They’re not hiring on their main webpage. Why is that? They have 0 turnover? They don’t trust the internet or their parent website to recruit? If they were getting ready to build these next year, they would be doing some kind of work on a former GM facility. That to me is a huge red flag. Anybody with any clue of how manufacturing or production knows you have to continually staff.

        • 1. This is a fun, open blog. We get right wing nuts, left wing nuts, and nuts that fall so far outside the nut spectrum that I think they might be, technically, acorns. Having fun with it is the only way to keep sane- especially on the Elio posts, which seem to really attract the weirdos.
          2. You’re right about the hiring thing. You might also know enough about manufacturing to realize how long it takes to tool up for production, and to actually produce the tools (molds, stamps, dies, etc.) required to build a car … if you do, that’s another 20 or 30 red flags for you to wave.

  • Steve

    your skepticism is healthy, but pretty dumb-founded. You really think that the number of sales when they start actually delivering the cars will be the same 74 sales a day they’re getting while they’re just taking reservations? I appreciate people looking into things in depth, but your way of doing it is pretty ignorant and mostly useless.

    • I think it’ll be lower, honestly. 74 * 365 is just over 27,000 units- and I don’t think they’ll sell 27,000 units.

    • kneesus

      Mine is based on the fact that they’re not hiring anybody on their career page. You have to think, even if you’re setting up a production facility, you will have a massive amount of turnover due to the sheer size of the work force. Why wouldn’t they recruit on their main page? Even if it’s a year out, you have to setup a facility for manufacturing a motor vehicle.

  • Bret

    “For those of you with long memories, 27,000
    cars is just over a third of the 68,000 cars Elio Motors needs to sell
    in its first year for its self-released numbers to add up- and it’s only
    11% of the 250,000 cars the company claims it will be able to sell,
    annually. That’s … well, it’s not a good sign for any company.’

    Well I do have a long memory. And for a small company producing just one model 27.000 units isn’t “bad”. From 1957-1979 Ford Motors built the Ranchero for U.S. sales at it’s Loraine, Ohio plant with some more built at Atlanta for just two years.
    And they built them in Camaçari, Bahia, Brazil Buenos Aires, Argentina and Oakville, Ontario, Canada for foreign sales. All this was in response to the Australian Ford Ute popularity there which began about 1955.
    According to Ford sales records which are published in a book all about them, they never sold more than 27.000 units a year, sometimes a little less than 20,000 a year.
    But it must have been successful for Ford or they wouldn’t have built them for 23 model years. If it was a loss it would have been dropped shortly, like the Edsel venture. And Chevrolet and GMC wouldn’t have been envious and feel compelled to mimic the vehicle with their versions from 1959 to 1987, or 28 model years, to get a piece of that market in sales. And with more advanced automation available now, the manpower numbers and labor costs would be lower now than it was then

    • Truth-censoredbyliberals

      Very good point. But I must add that the Ranchero did use some components from other models. But while more successful sales cars like say the economic Falcon was the principal vehicle the Ranchero was based upon from 1960-1965, they were made at entirely different plants. The Ranchero was primarily built at the Lorain plant that was dedicated exclusively to the Ranchero production only.
      There won’t be as many components in an Elio as virtually any other typical auto and the use of already existing available parts eliminates the necessity of a lot of further R&D to design and production costs for Elio to make them.

      • Bret

        Thanks, your right and I forgot to point that out. Mostly it was some body sheet metal, some glass, trim, seats, drivetrain and under the hood such things like that were the common shared components.
        It’s funny you mention the Falcon versions as I have one of those, a 1962. I’m debating having an off the frame restoration done to make it ‘cherry’ or sell it as is. Because the estimated labor cost given to me to do (just body and interior, no motor or manual transmission work) was almost $2000 dollars more than the cost of a new Elio. But I hope to be selling a house and property soon and one or the other may be my present to myself and I’ll invest the rest of the cash. Have a great day, and Cheers!

        • Truth-censoredbyliberals

          According to NADA Classic car values, Falcon Rancheros must be highly desired as they bring more than most of their Falcon counterparts even the much rarer sedan delivery models. Only the 1963-65 Falcon Futura Sprint convertibles with a V-8, four speed manual and air conditioning brings the same or more than Falcon Rancheros.

          A 1962 Ranchero is valued as following: The original 1962 MSRP was just $1889.
          But today:
          Low retail value is $8600-$8950
          Average retail value is $14,650-$15,300
          High retail value is $29,900-$30,700

          Sounds like it could be a good investment to restore it.
          To keep or to sell for profit, depending on your initial investment value, when you bought it of course.

          • Bret

            Thanks for the researched information. That Ranchero just started looking a little sweeter already. I bought it about 20 years ago or so. I think they were asking $1000 + or -. I know I negotiated but I can’t remember exactly what I paid for it, but it wasn’t what they were asking. My neighbor told me if he had it, he would never sell it… but he’s asked me twice so far if I would. I can see why now…

          • All the “utes” cost more. Think: El Camino.

          • Truth-censoredbyliberals

            Once more you feel you must opine on something you obviously know nothing about.

            A 1960 Chevrolet El Camino at todays values are:
            Original MSRP $2,366

            Low Retail $12,390

            Average Retail $25,620

            High Retail $50,610
            So research before you post what costs what in value.
            And another point a 1960 El Camino with its original V-8 engine will deliver about 11-maybe 14mpg 283-348 ci motors.
            A 1960-1965 Ford Falcon Rancheros with the inline six 144-170-200 ci motors delivered 30+ mpg.
            And with consistant gas prices at over $3.00 a gallon. mpg is a factor when considering a drivable classic to restore versus a classic that is cheaper to tow to a show than drive to a show in. Think about that!

        • In the 1960s, body sheet metal was often non-structural- or, at least, not structural to the point that it is today. Glass, also, and things like seats, crash structures, airbags, etc. are also expensive and need to be federalized at great expense- far more than what was involved in the 1960s.

          Unless Elio gets a major OEM to give them a lot of that stuff, or foot the bill, they’ll never crash test the thing as a car, and it will have to be sold as a motorcycle until new laws are written for the vehicle/class.

          • Bret

            More talking out your ass Jo Boreass… If you ever did research before your postings you would have known that Falcons were of ‘unibody’ construction. And body sheeting were indeed structural.

            Most particularly the Rancheros and sedan deliverys being more so.

            Also if you had done research by investigating the Elio website you would find out the list of suppliers for parts. The parts that have went into four running prototypes. The last one PS4 feature in orange that has been touring the country along with PS3 in silver are built with seats, seat belts, airbags (three by the way), built in roll cage (in the body structure) like the Pontiac Fiero. All the parts you mentioned and more are all built in America, used on oter cars, already have been federally tested and approved.

            Let’s just take a look at some of the OEM suppliers shall we? YES WE CAN!

            1. Admiral Tool
            Who is Admiral Tool?
            Admiral Tool is a leading tool and manufacturing company based in Livonia, Michigan. In addition to their world headquarters, Admiral Tool does their R&D and manufacturing in Livonia as well. They have over 75 employees focusing on their core tool and manufacturing business of approximately $30mm per year.
            What does supply to Elio Motors?
            Admiral Tool will provide the following parts for the Elio:
            The complete steering system.
            Why did Elio choose Admiral Tool?
            Having reliable systems to control the vehicle is of upmost importance for Elio Motors. Admiral Tool has a stellar reputation for high quality, reliable systems and utilizes incremental production methods including the serialization of all parts. Additionally, Admiral is a US company that supports our mission. They also make the systems for Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep.

            2. Dakkota Lighting Technology
            Who is Dakkota Lighting?
            Dakkota Lighting is located in Rochester, Michigan is part of the Dakkota family of companies which consist of Dakkota Integrated Systems with over 2000 employees in 10 locations in the US and Canada. Dakkota Lighting’s technological expertise includes Interior and Exterior Vehicle Lighting, Molding, Painting, Pad Printing, Injection Molding, Hot Stamping, Laser Etching, Foam in place and Assembly. They also design lighting for Interior and Exterior lighting applications utilizing the latest cutting edge technology in LED’s and the use of our “Ultra Glow” light pipe technology.

            They supply Chrysler Dodge, GM, Ford, Nissan, and three others.
            What does Dakkota Lighting supply to Elio Motors?
            Dakkota Lighting will partner with Elio motors to supply all of our interior molded panels and assemblies, IP Module and Cluster, Head Liner, Front Head Light and Rear Tail Light Assemblies.
            Why did Elio choose Dakkota Lighting?
            We chose Dakkota Lighting because of their process and technology capabilities include full-service interior integration, supplier management, assembly and sequencing, and just-in-time delivery.
            Options:
            Dakkota Lighting will be providing Elio Motors with many lighting related options including:
            Lit 3D Elio Graphic sill plate
            Lit Elio badge for the hood
            Lighted Vanity Visor with Integrated Map Light and Puddle Light
            Back Cargo Light puck light

            3.Eastern Catalytic
            Who is Eastern Catalytic?
            Eastern Manufacturing Inc. (Eastern Catalytic) is a world-class manufacturer of catalytic converters and related components. They are a family owned and operated US company for over 35 years. Eastern Catalytic is based in Langhorne, PA and will perform all manufacturing and R&D from this facility. They currently employ over 100 people and will be adding people to meet full production demand for our vehicle.
            Eastern incorporates the latest advanced-manufacturing technology, including automated workstations, spinner welding equipment, and high-speed production lines. Eastern Catalytic has expertise in welding, custom frames and designs, small and large diameter round and square tube bending in house. They also have both water jet and plasma cutters on site as well as custom built negative pressure R&D rooms.
            What does Eastern Catalytic supply to Elio Motors?
            Eastern Catalytic will be supplying Elio Motors the integrated exhaust manifold and catalytic converter, exhaust pipes and hangars, muffler, and tail pipe. Eastern Catalytic will have several options for performance and stainless steel exhaust systems as well as an entry for the trailer hitch.
            Why did Elio choose Eastern Catalytic?
            We chose Eastern Catalytic because of their world-class quality and innovation. Their continual improvements in converter design, production, and product delivery systems also were key deal points as well as being an American owned family business. They supply GM and Fiat

            4. IAV Automotive engineering
            Who is IAV?
            IAV has been developing automotive innovations since forming in 1983. Founded in Germany, IAV now provides services across the globe. The company and its staff have a uniquely broad spectrum of expertise. IAV works with its clients from initial ideas to production, offering extensive knowledge ranging from the entire system right down to individual component details.
            Throughout its history, IAV has developed and provided technologies and services to the automotive industry. Major accomplishments include the “Bi-Mot-Bus” a twin-engine city bus used 22 percent less fuel than comparable models that helped pave the way for future fuel efficient endeavors and partnering with Braunschweig University Technology in 2007, IAV built “Caroline,” a futuristic test vehicle that can maneuver its way through city traffic by itself.
            North American Headquarters for IAV is in Northville, Michigan where they have installed four state of the art test cells supporting an end-to-end development process to reduce development time and increase project expertise and efficiency.
            IAV employs over 5,500 people globally and 170 in North America and is the largest automotive engineering service provider in the world.
            What does IAV supply to Elio Motors?
            IAV is the engine designer for Elio Motors. They will design and develop the entire powertrain for the vehicle (engine, transmission, powertrain control system? Including performance, emissions, validation and endurance testing.
            Why did Elio choose IAV?
            Engine and powertrain engineering is at the heart of vehicles across the globe. As one of the leading development partners to the automotive industry, IAV offers a uniquely broad spectrum of expertise supported by more than 30 years of experience. IAV continues to develop innovations in driver assistance, lightweight construction and safety. They have a wide range of competencies, taking a project from the initial idea to mass production for sub-compacts to trucks and off-highway vehicles.

            They also supply to Ford GM Toyota Opel Fiat Mercedes Benz Porsche BMW Audi Peugot Renaut Citroen Smart Bugatti Chrysler VW Sert and Skoda.

            5. Peterson spring and suspension
            Who is Peterson Spring?
            Peterson Spring is a leading designer and manufacturer of engineered metal products, which includes springs of all types and sizes, coiled retaining rings, wire forms, spring-steel clamps, hose clamps, and assemblies for the automotive, industrial and motorsports markets.
            Peterson Spring is headquartered in Southfield, Michigan. This location also serves as the company’s technical and developmental hub which includes product design, product development, metallurgical analysis, engine/applications validation testing, and fatigue testing. They have an additional 11 manufacturing locations and two sales operating in four different countries, and will supply Elio Motors product from three North American plants located in Greenville, IL, Three Rivers, MI and Athens, GA plants.
            Peterson Spring is a privately held company that is a leader in the spring and wire products industry and has been for over 100 years. They currently have over 750 employees.
            What does Peterson Spring supply to Elio Motors?
            Peterson Spring will supply Elio Motors with our Engine Valve Train Components, Springs, Shock Absorbers, Stabilizer Bar Assembly and Wire forms.
            Why did Elio choose Peterson Spring?
            The “Peterson Performance Culture” is one reason that we chose Peterson Spring. Their disciplined approach improves quality, processes and much more. Their innovation by all employees coupled with state-of-the-art technology and tooling keeps them on the cutting edge of today’s industry trends.
            They supply to: GM Jaguar BMW Ford Chrysler Toyota Nissan Honda VW Audi KIa Mercedes Benz Volvo Harley Davidson and Hyundai.

            6. Kiekert AG
            What does Kiekert supply to Elio Motors?
            Kiekert will supply the door latch and striker for the vehicle.
            Why did Elio choose Kiekert AG?
            Kiekert AG, the world’s leading automotive supplier in the field of automotive locking systems, supplies the leading vehicle makers with its innovative latch technologies, among others BMW, Chrysler, Daimler, Ford, GM and VW Group
            7. Cooper Tires they already supply to Ford
            8. Henkel Coatings and Structural suppliers to Mini GM Lexus Alpha Romeo Honda Toyota Mercedes Benz Nissan Kia Bentley Porsche VW Infinity Chrysler Audi Ford Jaguar Peugot Renault Acura Skoda Land Rover Volvo Rolls Royce Citroen Opel Maserati BMW Ferrari Hyundai Bugatti Saab Mitsubishi Aston Martin Sert and Mazda.
            9. Technosports Creative suppliers to Ford GM Chrysler
            10.Altair suppliers to Ford GM Chrysler Mercedes Benz
            Toyota BMW Fiat Honda Nissan Saab Hyundai VW Jaguar and Land Rover.
            11. Comau Advanced manufacturing systems suppliers to: VW Ford GM Fiat Alpha Romeo Honda Mercedes Benz Maserati Ferrari and Renault
            12 Cooper Standard suppliers to: GM Chrysler Ford Mercedes Benz Toyota Porsche VW Honda Peugot Volvo Renault Citroen Opel Nissan BMW Audi Skoda Acura Saab Land Rover Mini and Alpha Romeo.
            13 Detroit Thermal Systems they supply to Ford.
            14.Guardian Glass Automotive they supply to GM Toyota Mercedes Benz VW Jaguar Bentley Porsche Ford Peugot Chrysler and Audi.
            15. Halla Mando Corporation brake and suspension suppliers to: Ford GM Chrysler Opel Kia and Hyundai.
            16.Irvin interior suppliers to: GM Chrysler Toyota and Honda.
            17. N3T suppliers of wiring harnesses to: GM Mitsubishi Chrysler Opel Valeo Tenneco Hebasto Icom Trico Cooper Standard Kiekert and Dakkota.
            18.JNM Tooling and Manufacturing Inc.
            Metal stampings suppliers to BMW
            19.Lear Corporation seating system suppliers to: Mini GM Hyundai Mitsubishi BMW Honda Toyota Mercedes Benz Nissan VW Alpha Romeo Porsche Chrysler Ford Audi Jaguar Peugot Renault Kia Volvo Land Rover Citroen Opel and Skoda.
            20.Plastics Research Corporation for body panels
            21.Superior Roll Forming Corportaion suppliers to: GM Ford Chrysler Honda Nissan VW Mercedes Benz Fiat and Toyota.
            22.Takata Safety Systems suppliers to: GM Jaguar Mercedes Benz Chrysler Ford Toyota Porsche VW Lexus Nissan Accura Honda Bentley Saab Audi Skoda Citroen Opel Mazda Rolls Royce Land Rover Hyundai BMW Ferrari Mitsubishi Aston Martin Sert Subaru and Infinity.
            That’s just to name some, the list is long.

            So what F’n expenses Joe Boreass? To use already existing parts off the self from NAPA, Auto Zone, or order from PartsGeek.com ?

            Really great expense? Once agai you talk out your ass about something you knew nothing about… only on your oppinion not what actually is.
            Stick to talking about something you know about, which is nothing.

          • Wow- you have a lot of time on your hands. I hope defending Elio is your job.

            Still, since you don’t seem to realize that the Falcon’s “structural” sheetmetal wouldn’t pass even the most basic modern crash tests *and* failed to realize that a “supplier” means “someone who will sell them stuff”, you don’t seem qualified for said job.

            Finally, parts being “available” doesn’t mean they’re free- they’re still expenses.

            Let me guess: you’re not a CPA, either? 😉

          • Bret

            HEY Bore-ass, Won’t you stick to defending your baseless, factless attacking points on Elio Motors. That way I won’t have to show the world where you erred in doing research… or more factually lack of doing ANY research before you post.

            Like:

            ” Glass, also, and things like seats, crash structures, airbags, etc. are also expensive and need to be federalized at great expense- far more than what was involved in the 1960s. Unless Elio gets a major OEM to give them a lot of that stuff, or foot the bill,”

            No OEM gives ‘gives’ any vehicle maufacturer anything ‘free’.
            Obviously you don’t run one of those or you would be out of business ‘giving stuff’ away. OEM suppliers sign contracts with manufacturers to supply certain numbers of parts per week or month of a desired quality asked for by the manufacturer. Those items were already designed, tested and passed.

            This is usually done on credit and billed and paid for later.
            I have worked both in the supply end for a parts warehouse for Honda for world wide distributions. And as a delivery truck driver (expedited) for auto and aircraft parts from OEM suppliers to the manufacturing plants and assembly lines. So I do know how that works thank you very much… and I am more in touch with what a OEM supplier is than you…
            Jo-Bore-Ass!

            Since you like putting out useless (bull) hockey, might as well grab a stick too and puck yourself. 😎

            If you had been in the Wright Brothers shop, you would have been the snot nose little know-it-all creepy twerp that told them… “Geez. everybody knows you can’t fly, you guys must be some kinda nuts”. Of course back then you could force to get rid of stupid morons like that and yourself and not be sued for it.

            Now we have the ACLU and the liberal DemocRats who defend the morons and low information people and even encourage their underacheiving and stupidity.
            So you do have someone on your side Jo-Bore-Ass!

  • Charles Blackburn

    Hey Have you produced anything but hot air… please It’s very obvious your quite full of hot air… and a considerable naysayer…

    • When it comes to Elio, that’s true. Tesla, too- and I was wrong about that! Tesla brought in experts from Toyota and Mercedes, though. Who does Elio have?

      • Bret

        Tesla’s big problem was E-x-s-p-e-n-s-e. You’ve e;iminated a great portion of the sales market when your vehicle is priced at $100.000 or so. Plus they had a tendency to catch fire when recharging.
        The fact your vehicle burns down your hous with it… isn’t a good selling point either.
        So yeah in Tesla’s case they DID need some expert help.
        Not the same case with an under $7000 dollar vehicle with a time tested relialble internal combustion power plant. That’s the difference, Jo-Bore-Ass!

        • Truth-censoredbyliberals

          And there is that pesky testy-Tesla sticky wicket… 230 miles (maximum) before you need a complete recharge.

          Another selling issue. Read the fine print. 230 miles under ideal circumstances (maximum). Meaning flat land, not running a/c, lights, accessories etc. at mininum cruise speed…’ideal’.

          In other words, careful before you drive from Dallas-Ft.Worth to El Paso or vice versa. More than 230 miles of desert and nothing out there. Or say, crossing Fargo, N.D. to Boise ID.
          Probably no super chargers along the way.
          And be sure to schedule extra time on your vacation drive to Florida. You’ll be needing to rechage several times each way… when you can find a place to do that.

        • If that’s true, how is Tesla out-pacing Elio? They got 13,000 reservations for their Model X in about 60 days. What’s your area of expertise, again? You must be good at it, since you’ve put on the blinders when it comes to the auto industry.

          • Bret

            Quite simple like yourself Jo-Bore-Ass.
            What percentage of the U.S.population can afford a $100,000 dollar vehicle? Answer: very small and limited.
            Now what percentage of the U.S.population can afford a less than $7000 dollar vehicle? Answer: well most anyone since it will cost half of most new economy cars cost or less and about the price of a decade old used Toyota Camry.
            Now if you’re an elitest snob from Beverly Hills and or Hollywood celebrity (ala Justin Beiber types) who must concern themselves with status… being seen as chic’ and cool and you have more dollars than sense, then blowing a cool $100 grand is nothing to you. And will get you exactly 230 miles (if you’re lucky) before refueling (so to speak). Then the Tesla is for you I guess.
            While on the other hand if you’re the average American who commutes to and from work, but needs a vehicle to go and visit family and friends who live farther away than 230 miles. And you have a limited budget for purchase and fuel costs. Then spending less than $7000 and getting 80+ miles to the gallon is very appealing and affordable.
            And you’ll find you still have money for the house payment or rent, food, clothing and insurance payments etc.
            Tesla is a high dollar item, they spent lots of moola to get advertisement, received goverment subsidies for startup and promotion. And it still almost failed… well did actually and had to be bailed by investers.
            Elio is a lower budget vehicle and designed to be so for cost efffectiveness. They are on a constant cross country showing. Here where they came to display the latest protoytype four local news channels covered it and four local newspapers and two radio stations in just four hours time. And we are small time here. It takes time and effort to get the word out, and they will. And what is even stronger, will be ownership word of mouth to people who see them and ask questions, and they indeed will ask.
            I can remember when Honda first announced they would build a car and people laughed “motorcycle company build a car? really?”. Then they came out with some, powered with the Honda motorcycle 750cc inline four, (same as on the old CB750’s). Again they laughed at it’s small size.
            But gasoline was 25 cents a gallon back then though too.
            Now do you see anyone laughing at Honda cars now?
            Answer: NO!
            It just take the right answers to the current issues to be a success. Cost affordability, operative cost affordability etc.
            Understand Jo-Bore-Ass?

          • Truth-censoredbyliberals

            Unlike Bore-Ass I researched before I posted this I found from Tesla’s own website for actual cost to buy and operate a Tesla.

            Purcahase cost for basic model monthly payment: $986 / mo. Finance based on:

            This example includes a 3.5% annual percentage rate, 10% down payment, and 72-month loan term, excluding fees, sales tax, and registration.

            Cash Price $71,010

            Rate 3.50% interest on loan

            Down Payment 10% or $7101

            Term 72 months or six years

            Effective Monthly Cost to operate recharges and eventual battery replacement costs averaged at $609 / mo.

            So it’s almost a $1000 a month car payment and another $600 a month to operate and maintain it… $1600 a month.
            Do you know how much home and property you could own for $1600 a month? Oh, and unlike a Tesla it won’t depreciate in value over the years.

          • While utterly irrelevant to this article, I’ll play.

            Despite the higher price, Tesla has sold 13,000 reservations for the upcoming Model X already, out-pacing the Elio. How’s that 1950s “supply and demand” theory panning out for you now?

          • Bret

            13,000 reservations in 60 days… REALLY?
            I would be impressed if you weren’t LYING!

            Because by Tesla’s own website:

            The car was first officially revealed to the public on July 19, 2006, in Santa Monica, California.

            Since production began in 2008 Tesla had sold more than 2,400 units in 31 countries through September 2012.

            Four years and 2400 units… uh, I believe that is 600 a year.
            In 31 countries… hmm about 20 per country each year or 80 per country over a 4 year span… big whoop!

            And you claim Elio start-up is lame? REALLY?

            How does historical fact feel biting you in yor Bore-Ass???

            And it isn’t irrelevant when you are touting how great Tesla’s are, just to research them and report the real facts about it.

          • Yup. It helps to know which car you’re talking about- but since you’ve proven yourself to be a (laughably unqualified) shill for Elio over and over again, I’ll just leave this here.

            http://gas2.org/2014/03/24/tesla-model-x-reservations-exceed-12000/

          • Bret

            No paid shill here… just someone who will fact check (unlike yourself) and call you out when you lie and F-up.

            That’s easy to do, because you do it so readily and often.

            Example: you slam (bashing) Elio for projecting numbers of production upon start-up. And let’s just say it’s only 25,000 the first year.

            Well heck, lower it some more, say it’s only 15,000 units.

            Let’s compare that with Tesla whom you tout as being so great and adept in their start-up. I repeat the documented numbers put out by Tesla themselves. NOT your false claims in your worthless blogs…

            ‘Four years and 2400 units… uh, I believe that is 600 a year.
            In 31 countries… hmm about 20 per country each year or 80 per country over a 4 year span… big whoop!’
            You see why we find your lunatic logic that Elio can’t make it if they don’t sell 100,000 or just 50,000 or only 25,000 a year.
            Your own numbers claims reveal that you are a delusional buffoon! If your IQ was as large as your ego you would be a genius… but that is simply not the case.
            You are an egotistical moron of only the cretinous level of intellect!

          • Bret

            13,000 reservations in 60 days… REALLY?
            I would be impressed if you weren’t LYING!

            Because by Tesla’s own website:

            The car was first officially revealed to the public on July 19, 2006, in Santa Monica, California.

            Since production began in 2008 Tesla had sold more than 2,400 units in 31 countries through September 2012.

            Four years and 2400 units… uh, I believe that is 600 a year.

            And you claim Elio is lame? REALLY?

          • You’re thinking of the Model S.

          • Bret

            No Jo-Bore-Ass, I am blowing up your claim that Elio’s start up projections numbers are so lame that it will NEVER work. compared to Tesla’s start-up you tout as being so magnificient.
            If you want to know the truth about the X reservations, read Truth’s post… unlike your moronic posts HE researched your numbers claim and found them to be just as bogus,as usual.

          • :: sigh ::

            I really can’t decide if you people are stupid, or monumentally stupid.

            http://gas2.org/2014/03/24/tesla-model-x-reservations-exceed-12000/

          • Bret

            The reason you DON”T KNOW, Jo-Bore-Ass is clear to all of us who are completely sure what you are.

            And that is a Pompous Jack-Ass with a blog… nothing more.

            You have exactly zero experience or first-hand knowledge of what it takes to start a mass production vehicle manufacturing company from day one ground zero. But you do know that you hate Elio, for whatever the reason in your psychopathic mind is. So you post worthless opinion points and are delusional enough to pat yourself on the back, thinking they are some how inciteful and intellectual… which they indeed are not.
            Just worthless drivel posted by a moron with a huge ego.

          • Truth-censoredbyliberals

            From Green Car Reports
            Antony Ingram
            Mar 27, 2014

            For an electric sedan priced above the reach of many people, sales of the Tesla Model S have been rather impressive so far.

            That relative popularity should also carry over to the firm’s upcoming crossover, the 2015 Tesla Model X.

            The Tesla Motors Club is tracking Model X reservations, and so far that number has crept over 13,000 units worldwide, with over 10,000 units in North America alone.

            The club notes that these numbers should be taken with a grain of salt, and are based on the sequence number of reservation holders across the world rather than solid data from Tesla Motors. The number does not consider any cancellations, and reservation holders who may have upgraded from a regular production model to a Signature have been counted twice.

  • Knuckles Mutatis

    So hoping this isn’t some form of automotive vaporware. If this does live up to the estimated price/performance estimates, and is of decent quality & reliability, I’ll gladly purchase this vehicle…to do so is like rolling gas prices back to $1/gallon for a 21 mpg car (or will be in another month or so when gas hits $4/gallon again).

  • Maureen

    Still bashing away there Joey boy? Oh, as you can see, I haven’t died yet. Still waiting for you to go first…….what’s taking you so long?

    • You know how it is- you look both ways before crossing the street, don’t blow all your health insurance money on cars that don’t exist, yadda-yadda-yadda you don’t die. Crazy, huh?

  • Gregory Anthamatten

    Snowball effect. Do you know what that is? 74 people per
    month who are ‘true believers’ is a riduculous measure to estimate their first
    year’s sales AFTER PRODUCTION! Besides, the numbers you provided, 74 new
    customers a day, is very good if you consider that that number has risen 135% today. Do the math for the last 29 days.
    HAHA! Applying the math, every 29 days the growth raises 130% then we get… 281/29
    = 9.7 so… 17,413 in 29 days, from now. AND 192,144 by 01/01/15. That’s
    assuming the growth rate does not increase…it will (most people still have no
    idea that the Elio Motors’ idea exists).

    You also write as if people will have the same reservations
    about buying the car when it hits the road–that’s bullshit! When people start
    to see it rolling, and hear the drivers’ response–and savings–they’ll be all
    over it. Stop acting like you understand the numbers, you don’t. Except for
    Obama, you’re right there, but you are way off on your growth projection
    because you are basing it on numbers now. That’s like looking at a bacteria
    culture after a day and saying, “it only made one more cell….this can’t
    grow into an infection.” Take a calculus class and learn about ‘rate of
    change.’

    • Gregory Anthamatten

      oops, I was basing that number off of 29 days (the time this article was published to today). The real number is 26 days (the last day Elio updated it’s reservation number), that brings Elio’s number to at least 250,000 by 01/01/15….we’ll see.

    • If that’s true, then why aren’t cars like the Mitsubishi Mirage selling like hotcakes? You know, a car that exists today, sells for about $10K, gets 44+ MPG, etc.?

  • kneesus

    I’ll believe it will happen when they start hiring people.

    • DeLorean, Fisker, Tucker, and American Motors employed lots of people before imploding- but, yeah. That would help build some trust.

  • 1. I called you mentally deficient, not mentally defunct (it means something different).
    2. I didn’t call you a homosexual (even if I did, the fact that you’d consider that an insult says more about you than me). I did call your Mustang a secretary’s car, though … but you’ll have to blame Ford for that (see below).
    3. I think you might be illiterate, since you claimed a bunch of sales figure info. for Ford Mustangs based on MPG and HP that was factually incorrect, and a cursory reading of the company’s history- had you been able to parse the data- would have told you that.

  • Harley Logan

    Jo, I’d personally like to just say “thanks” for your critical commentary. I didn’t know a thing about Elio until a coworker came back from the CES tradeshow and mentioned it. I looked them up and got all the marketing info and “selling points”, but your articles were the only ones I ran across actually contributing an objective counterpoise by pointing out that their numbers just don’t add up, which should be a huge red flag. Personally, I’d be in the market for something like the Elio and hope you’re wrong and that they succeed, but the fact is that their sales projections are far too aggressive to be taken seriously as you pointed out, so on that point I agree
    with you.

    Frankly, I’m a little bewildered at the amount of aggression and attention being directed at you for simply stating facts by some of the other “commenters”. I have to wonder what motivates these trolls and brings them out of the woodwork. Are they just Elio fanboys who feel the need to attack and target you for criticizing their pet-du-jour , or are they professionals? I’ve personally dealt with marketers and have a good first-hand grasp of their sly tendencies to mischaracterize, misrepresent and villainize legitimate criticism. Anyway, after wading through some of this nonsense I decided to post a quick note just to say thanks for providing a counterpoint to all the hype.

  • FEAR MY PATELLA

    I sincerely hope this works. I want one badly – as a motorcyclist who occasionally wants a cage this could seriously fit a bill. and even if it goes up by 20% I’d still come out ahead over a year with the amount of miles I typically travel in a year.

    And wouldn’t it be nice if an actual US company got to come out with an actual US product that appealed to the segment of the market that cannot fathom the need for the typical US car?

  • Thomas Eric Bowser

    You seem to be very opinionated against this car and it’s manufacturer. It is not slated for release until 2015 and by then, especially seeing that now there have been over 16,000 reserved(Including myself) it will definitely sell. Its affordable and gets better mileage than almost anything else on the market. Most states have confirmed that it will not require a motorcycle license or a helmet either.

  • Mike

    As much as I have enjoyed the rigorous back and forth between wishers and haters, I will have to agree with Jo. I cannot see any fathomable way to produce a vehicle that retails for only $6800. Tooling costs will be astronomical, how are they going to recoup the cost and continue with production? If they launch and can sustain, I will sell my Fatboy to buy one

  • newsreader

    Looks more promising every day.
    Hope it doesn’t go the way of Aptera and others.
    When it actually gets a crash rating, then I’ll gamble a $100 and get in line.
    The goals may be a bit optimistic, but who develops a new product being pessimistic?

  • stan wetch

    If Elio Motors needs to sell 68,000 units year one or their business model if a failure -then yes your criticism is very warranted.
    Although IF they can pull off this bike/car in mass production with a price of $6800 made in US and the quality is what they are saying-they WILL have a huge hit.
    I showed this to 3 different college kids and they all said ‘I’m in’.
    Question is-can they sustain this production and maintain quality at that price? If not they are leading investors down a dangerous path.
    I hope to be driving one soon, but won’t hold my breath.

  • oldmagicman666

    Some people just want pollution free electric until you realize the electricity to charge the batteries comes from a coal fired generating plant! Gas is still the fuel of transportation! Fill up the tank and drive 600+ miles! Run low and fill up in two minutes, drive away for $25! If you had the time to walk that far you would wear out more than $25 in shoe leather!

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