As we’ve talked about on these pages before, the battle for the hearts and minds of the next generation of car purchasers is starting. By the end of the year many major auto manufacturers will have some kind of electric vehicle for sale on the mass market and by 2014, nearly all major manufacturers have plans to introduce at least one electric car.
In these early stages, carmakers have chosen several different paths, some opting to go for the cars powered solely by batteries (Battery Electric Vehicles or BEVs) such as the Nissan LEAF, some for the plug-in hybrids (PHEVs; like a Prius with a bigger battery), and some for the extended range electric vehicles (EREVs with small generators on board to charge the batteries) such as the Chevy Volt.
Chevy has chosen to go with the more expensive EREV option because they felt that the idea of “range anxiety” would be so all-consuming to the initial electric car consumer that it would drive them away from buying one. Although there is research showing the range anxiety question may be overblown, GM has stuck to its guns believing that the question will trump all other consumer considerations. But it now appears that even GM sees EREVs as a stepping stone to a future filled with the less expensive BEVs.
In a post over at GM-Volt, Mark Reuss, GM’s new North American President, has come right out and said that long term demand for BEVs will be higher than EREVs, but that EREVs are necessary to get to the BEV future. “While EREV will be wildly popular at first with Volt, as the technology flows down to BEV in what will be smaller cars to carry smaller packs, that may be the higher volume play over a longer time,” Reuss was quoted as saying.
I’m not sure about this logic. It already appears that battery prices are dropping much faster than expected and that consumers may never even have the chance to really worry about range anxiety in the first place, given that most buyers will probably own two cars (a gas one and an electric one) and that most days they will drive far less than the 80-100 mile electric range. I’m just not clear what the incentive will be to buy a $40,000 Volt over a $25,000 LEAF unless you are planning on replacing just one car. And even then, how many one car households are going to go out and plunk down $40,000?
Actually, GM’s argument that EREVs are a stepping stone to BEVs runs opposite to what I’ve always felt; that BEVs are the stepping stone to EREVs. BEVs are much cheaper and easier to engineer. Bring them on and market them as a second car in two (or more) car households. Then, when battery prices come down from the adoption of BEVs, build EREVs to meet the needs of one car households, or to replace all the cars in a two (or more) car household.
Only time will tell, but I’m starting to get a bad feeling about this for GM. Too bad we, the taxpayers, still own them… hurry up and buy yourselves back already GM!
Source: GM-Volt.com
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EREV = plug-in serial hybrid. I know GM wants to call this an EV, but it is what it is.
Sincerely, Neil
EREV = plug-in serial hybrid. I know GM wants to call this an EV, but it is what it is.
Sincerely, Neil
It’s too expensive buying hybrid cars. They need to make the prices more realistic.
It’s too expensive buying hybrid cars. They need to make the prices more realistic.
It’s too early to pronounce winners and losers. By this time next year, we’ll know if Nissan or GM had the best product and business plan.
The Volt is clearly a compromise designed to satisfy everyone at GM. Thankfully, the drivetrain is mainly electric, so they could easily remove the range extender if needed.
It’s too early to pronounce winners and losers. By this time next year, we’ll know if Nissan or GM had the best product and business plan.
The Volt is clearly a compromise designed to satisfy everyone at GM. Thankfully, the drivetrain is mainly electric, so they could easily remove the range extender if needed.
Huh…they call it a ‘stepping stone’ to an EV….
I thought they decided to go with the more expensive EREV so in 2 years they could kill the project and say, “See! No one wants to pay for a car like this.”
I don’t know which is worse, that, or the “We can’t make gobs of money on a small fuel efficient vehicle, so we won’t build it” excuse.
GM bashing aside, I hope there’s enough (rich) early adopters that will pave the way for the rest of us to purchase affordable EV’s in the near future.
Huh…they call it a ‘stepping stone’ to an EV….
I thought they decided to go with the more expensive EREV so in 2 years they could kill the project and say, “See! No one wants to pay for a car like this.”
I don’t know which is worse, that, or the “We can’t make gobs of money on a small fuel efficient vehicle, so we won’t build it” excuse.
GM bashing aside, I hope there’s enough (rich) early adopters that will pave the way for the rest of us to purchase affordable EV’s in the near future.
Nick – You seem genuinely surprised at GM’s attitude of EV’s. I know you have an admiration for GM as a whole (although where you got it is beyond me), but can you honestly believe you couldn’t see this coming? GM does not want anything to do with next generation vehicles. Period.
By the way, that Volt thing of theirs – Is it in actual production yet or are they still promoting the prototypes around the country? It’s been, what?, 6, 7 years since the ground-breaking of Volt?
Think about it…
Nick – You seem genuinely surprised at GM’s attitude of EV’s. I know you have an admiration for GM as a whole (although where you got it is beyond me), but can you honestly believe you couldn’t see this coming? GM does not want anything to do with next generation vehicles. Period.
By the way, that Volt thing of theirs – Is it in actual production yet or are they still promoting the prototypes around the country? It’s been, what?, 6, 7 years since the ground-breaking of Volt?
Think about it…
Douglas,
I really don’t appreciate the veiled criticism thing. If you think every other person on the face of the planet who thinks the Volt is cool and has great potential to be a success is stupid, just say it. In my opinion, that stance is kind of ridiculous, but you’re entitled to your opinion too.
Based on my interaction with GM execs of all types, I’m convinced that GM does want to be heavily involved in next gen vehicles. Maybe they haven’t shown the outward desire that company like Nissan has, but, honestly, neither has Toyota. So what? The point is that a major transformation is happening and any company that doesn’t get on board faces extinction. You think GM hasn’t analyzed the situation thoroughly? They see the writing on the wall just like every other carmaker.
No, the Volt hasn’t been around for “6, 7 years.” It’s been 3.5 since they unveiled it. 3.5 years from concept to production is an amazing accomplishment.
My surprise with GM has nothing to do with the accomplishment of the Volt or their commitment to next gen cars, but more to do with their strategy. To say that EREVs are the stepping stone to BEVs just seems, well, backwards. In terms of their commitment to next gen cars: There are now dozens of pre-production Volts around the country (not prototypes) and a few hundred production Volts are slated to be built in the next few months as test cars and for media coverage. Not even Nissan has that many plug-in test cars on the road, and Nissan’s planning on selling like five times as many LEAFs the first year than GM is Volts. All-in-all, GM has done a much better job of actually documenting their production of the Volt than any other carmaker has at showing how ready their next gen cars are for production. We are now less then a year away from the launch of electric car 2.0, and GM is the only one with a solid test fleet. What does that tell you about everybody else?
Douglas,
I really don’t appreciate the veiled criticism thing. If you think every other person on the face of the planet who thinks the Volt is cool and has great potential to be a success is stupid, just say it. In my opinion, that stance is kind of ridiculous, but you’re entitled to your opinion too.
Based on my interaction with GM execs of all types, I’m convinced that GM does want to be heavily involved in next gen vehicles. Maybe they haven’t shown the outward desire that company like Nissan has, but, honestly, neither has Toyota. So what? The point is that a major transformation is happening and any company that doesn’t get on board faces extinction. You think GM hasn’t analyzed the situation thoroughly? They see the writing on the wall just like every other carmaker.
No, the Volt hasn’t been around for “6, 7 years.” It’s been 3.5 since they unveiled it. 3.5 years from concept to production is an amazing accomplishment.
My surprise with GM has nothing to do with the accomplishment of the Volt or their commitment to next gen cars, but more to do with their strategy. To say that EREVs are the stepping stone to BEVs just seems, well, backwards. In terms of their commitment to next gen cars: There are now dozens of pre-production Volts around the country (not prototypes) and a few hundred production Volts are slated to be built in the next few months as test cars and for media coverage. Not even Nissan has that many plug-in test cars on the road, and Nissan’s planning on selling like five times as many LEAFs the first year than GM is Volts. All-in-all, GM has done a much better job of actually documenting their production of the Volt than any other carmaker has at showing how ready their next gen cars are for production. We are now less then a year away from the launch of electric car 2.0, and GM is the only one with a solid test fleet. What does that tell you about everybody else?
Nick – You seem genuinely surprised at GM’s attitude of EV’s. I know you have an admiration for GM as a whole (although where you got it is beyond me), but can you honestly believe you couldn’t see this coming? GM does not want anything to do with next generation vehicles. Period.
By the way, that Volt thing of theirs – Is it in actual production yet or are they still promoting the prototypes around the country? It’s been, what?, 6, 7 years since the ground-breaking of Volt?
Think about it…
Douglas,
I really don’t appreciate the veiled criticism thing. If you think every other person on the face of the planet who thinks the Volt is cool and has great potential to be a success is stupid, just say it. In my opinion, that stance is kind of ridiculous, but you’re entitled to your opinion too.
Based on my interaction with GM execs of all types, I’m convinced that GM does want to be heavily involved in next gen vehicles. Maybe they haven’t shown the outward desire that company like Nissan has, but, honestly, neither has Toyota. So what? The point is that a major transformation is happening and any company that doesn’t get on board faces extinction. You think GM hasn’t analyzed the situation thoroughly? They see the writing on the wall just like every other carmaker.
No, the Volt hasn’t been around for “6, 7 years.” It’s been 3.5 since they unveiled it. 3.5 years from concept to production is an amazing accomplishment.
My surprise with GM has nothing to do with the accomplishment of the Volt or their commitment to next gen cars, but more to do with their strategy. To say that EREVs are the stepping stone to BEVs just seems, well, backwards. In terms of their commitment to next gen cars: There are now dozens of pre-production Volts around the country (not prototypes) and a few hundred production Volts are slated to be built in the next few months as test cars and for media coverage. Not even Nissan has that many plug-in test cars on the road, and Nissan’s planning on selling like five times as many LEAFs the first year than GM is Volts. All-in-all, GM has done a much better job of actually documenting their production of the Volt than any other carmaker has at showing how ready their next gen cars are for production. We are now less then a year away from the launch of electric car 2.0, and GM is the only one with a solid test fleet. What does that tell you about everybody else?
I would like to buy a fully electric plug-in car and am not buying a new car until I can buy a fully electric plug-in car. I am happy to buy an imported electric car if Australian car makers GM, Ford and Toyota are too slow and dopey to give me the car I want.
I would like to buy a fully electric plug-in car and am not buying a new car until I can buy a fully electric plug-in car. I am happy to buy an imported electric car if Australian car makers GM, Ford and Toyota are too slow and dopey to give me the car I want.
GM has got it right with the transition to full electric vehicles. Lithium ion batteries haven’t hit the market place yet and consumers will be wary. The technology will improve in the near future, but that’s not here today. You state that range extended vehicles will be much more expensive. Subterfuge. Its the batteries. An on board generator is simple old technology, and aren’t that expensive. You have lots of opinion. GM has done their homework and has the facts. They’re creating a product that will meet the needs of all drivers, not just those that drive less than 40 miles a day. That doesn’t mean the Nissan Leaf won’t find its niche. See business school 101.
GM has got it right with the transition to full electric vehicles. Lithium ion batteries haven’t hit the market place yet and consumers will be wary. The technology will improve in the near future, but that’s not here today. You state that range extended vehicles will be much more expensive. Subterfuge. Its the batteries. An on board generator is simple old technology, and aren’t that expensive. You have lots of opinion. GM has done their homework and has the facts. They’re creating a product that will meet the needs of all drivers, not just those that drive less than 40 miles a day. That doesn’t mean the Nissan Leaf won’t find its niche. See business school 101.
Pete,
You’re absolutely right, there is a lot of opinion in this post, and in many of my other posts. It’s called blogging. If my statement that EREVs are much more expensive is “subterfuge,” please explain why the Volt will cost about $40,000 and the LEAF will cost about $25,000 when introduced… especially considering the the Volt has a 16 kWh battery and the LEAF has a 24 kWh battery. Your claim that the battery is the largest expense doesn’t really add up in the face of facts. You have to understand that it’s not just the raw materials that these companies have to recoup in their sale price, it’s the cost of years of research, development and testing too. Engineering an EREV has proven to be much more costly than engineering a pure BEV. GM’s plan to create a vehicle that meets the needs of all drivers doesn’t jibe with the fact that the vehicle is priced far out of most buyers’ means. Although the appeal for a BEV like the LEAF may be less than an all-purpose EREV, the market that can afford the LEAF’s price is much larger, hence the effective market size is much larger. That, I believe, is business school 102.
Pete,
You’re absolutely right, there is a lot of opinion in this post, and in many of my other posts. It’s called blogging. If my statement that EREVs are much more expensive is “subterfuge,” please explain why the Volt will cost about $40,000 and the LEAF will cost about $25,000 when introduced… especially considering the the Volt has a 16 kWh battery and the LEAF has a 24 kWh battery. Your claim that the battery is the largest expense doesn’t really add up in the face of facts. You have to understand that it’s not just the raw materials that these companies have to recoup in their sale price, it’s the cost of years of research, development and testing too. Engineering an EREV has proven to be much more costly than engineering a pure BEV. GM’s plan to create a vehicle that meets the needs of all drivers doesn’t jibe with the fact that the vehicle is priced far out of most buyers’ means. Although the appeal for a BEV like the LEAF may be less than an all-purpose EREV, the market that can afford the LEAF’s price is much larger, hence the effective market size is much larger. That, I believe, is business school 102.
GM has got it right with the transition to full electric vehicles. Lithium ion batteries haven’t hit the market place yet and consumers will be wary. The technology will improve in the near future, but that’s not here today. You state that range extended vehicles will be much more expensive. Subterfuge. Its the batteries. An on board generator is simple old technology, and aren’t that expensive. You have lots of opinion. GM has done their homework and has the facts. They’re creating a product that will meet the needs of all drivers, not just those that drive less than 40 miles a day. That doesn’t mean the Nissan Leaf won’t find its niche. See business school 101.
Pete,
You’re absolutely right, there is a lot of opinion in this post, and in many of my other posts. It’s called blogging. If my statement that EREVs are much more expensive is “subterfuge,” please explain why the Volt will cost about $40,000 and the LEAF will cost about $25,000 when introduced… especially considering the the Volt has a 16 kWh battery and the LEAF has a 24 kWh battery. Your claim that the battery is the largest expense doesn’t really add up in the face of facts. You have to understand that it’s not just the raw materials that these companies have to recoup in their sale price, it’s the cost of years of research, development and testing too. Engineering an EREV has proven to be much more costly than engineering a pure BEV. GM’s plan to create a vehicle that meets the needs of all drivers doesn’t jibe with the fact that the vehicle is priced far out of most buyers’ means. Although the appeal for a BEV like the LEAF may be less than an all-purpose EREV, the market that can afford the LEAF’s price is much larger, hence the effective market size is much larger. That, I believe, is business school 102.
Nick, this is the sentence I don’t agree with. Range anxiety is huge for an enormous part of the potential market.
“It already appears that battery prices are dropping much faster than expected and that consumers may never even have the chance to really worry about range anxiety in the first place, given that most buyers will probably own two cars (a gas one and an electric one) and that most days they will drive far less than the 80-100 mile electric range.”
I think we need to distinguish between first generation and following generations of the technology. You’re right, that few people will pay $40,000 for a volt. The Volt hasn’t yet been priced for the mass market. It’s all marketing and hype at the moment. Initial huge investment in engineering, etc. is the cost of entry into the market. Manufacturers know that recouping those costs will take years maybe a decade. R & D is long-term capital investment (back to business school 101). I respectfully disagree that a BEV is much less expensive than GM’s EREV. As I understand it the VOLT only differs from a BEV with a small on board generator.
We all know this. It’s implied. You wrote, “You have to understand that it’s not just the raw materials that these companies have to recoup in their sale price, it’s the cost of years of research, development and testing too. Engineering an EREV has proven to be much more costly than engineering a pure BEV.” This last sentence makes me wonder. Actually, I don’t see much of a difference between the Volt and a BEV. The Prius is another animal. With the Volt’s on board generator the extended range problem appears as if it can be addressed. My opinion (forecast) is that second and third generations of electric vehicles will see a great improvement in the technology (electric range) and competitive pricing. I agree with you. GM isn’t going to sell many Volt’s at $40,000. I also believe that price is going to come down to about $25,000 if they are serious about mass marketing electric cars. Interesting Blog. Pete
Nick, this is the sentence I don’t agree with. Range anxiety is huge for an enormous part of the potential market.
“It already appears that battery prices are dropping much faster than expected and that consumers may never even have the chance to really worry about range anxiety in the first place, given that most buyers will probably own two cars (a gas one and an electric one) and that most days they will drive far less than the 80-100 mile electric range.”
I think we need to distinguish between first generation and following generations of the technology. You’re right, that few people will pay $40,000 for a volt. The Volt hasn’t yet been priced for the mass market. It’s all marketing and hype at the moment. Initial huge investment in engineering, etc. is the cost of entry into the market. Manufacturers know that recouping those costs will take years maybe a decade. R & D is long-term capital investment (back to business school 101). I respectfully disagree that a BEV is much less expensive than GM’s EREV. As I understand it the VOLT only differs from a BEV with a small on board generator.
We all know this. It’s implied. You wrote, “You have to understand that it’s not just the raw materials that these companies have to recoup in their sale price, it’s the cost of years of research, development and testing too. Engineering an EREV has proven to be much more costly than engineering a pure BEV.” This last sentence makes me wonder. Actually, I don’t see much of a difference between the Volt and a BEV. The Prius is another animal. With the Volt’s on board generator the extended range problem appears as if it can be addressed. My opinion (forecast) is that second and third generations of electric vehicles will see a great improvement in the technology (electric range) and competitive pricing. I agree with you. GM isn’t going to sell many Volt’s at $40,000. I also believe that price is going to come down to about $25,000 if they are serious about mass marketing electric cars. Interesting Blog. Pete
Nick, this is the sentence I don’t agree with. Range anxiety is huge for an enormous part of the potential market.
“It already appears that battery prices are dropping much faster than expected and that consumers may never even have the chance to really worry about range anxiety in the first place, given that most buyers will probably own two cars (a gas one and an electric one) and that most days they will drive far less than the 80-100 mile electric range.”
I think we need to distinguish between first generation and following generations of the technology. You’re right, that few people will pay $40,000 for a volt. The Volt hasn’t yet been priced for the mass market. It’s all marketing and hype at the moment. Initial huge investment in engineering, etc. is the cost of entry into the market. Manufacturers know that recouping those costs will take years maybe a decade. R & D is long-term capital investment (back to business school 101). I respectfully disagree that a BEV is much less expensive than GM’s EREV. As I understand it the VOLT only differs from a BEV with a small on board generator.
We all know this. It’s implied. You wrote, “You have to understand that it’s not just the raw materials that these companies have to recoup in their sale price, it’s the cost of years of research, development and testing too. Engineering an EREV has proven to be much more costly than engineering a pure BEV.” This last sentence makes me wonder. Actually, I don’t see much of a difference between the Volt and a BEV. The Prius is another animal. With the Volt’s on board generator the extended range problem appears as if it can be addressed. My opinion (forecast) is that second and third generations of electric vehicles will see a great improvement in the technology (electric range) and competitive pricing. I agree with you. GM isn’t going to sell many Volt’s at $40,000. I also believe that price is going to come down to about $25,000 if they are serious about mass marketing electric cars. Interesting Blog. Pete
Nick – My apologies at the tone of my note. I guess it came across a little strong. I certainly don’t “think every other person on the face of the planet who thinks the Volt is cool and has great potential to be a success is stupid”. Quite the contrary, I’m enormously in favor of EV’s and EV technology.
It’s GM I have the problem with. Those blowhards have been shouting the “Look, We’re Green!” chant so often and so long now, it’s become tinnitus. Every time they bellow from the mountain top that the Volt Has Arrived, they turn around and pop that balloon with another battery of tests or another upgrade that needs done, so the deployment gets pushed off another 3 months, 6 months, a year, whatever. In the meanwhile they continue to churn out the gas suckers, plead like whiny tarts for more money from congress, and see the top minds of their Great Big Green Tech departments flee like rats from a sinking ship. It sure as hell feels like they’ve been talking up the Volt for 6 or 7 years. And so much for that.
I know you’ve been reporting on the EV scene for quite some time, Nick, and I won’t deny you may have an “insider” access the rest of us don’t. But perhaps that coziness with GM’s suits has dulled your edging on reporting on their company. We all would like to have the US auto industry return to it’s glory days, but realistically it’s just no gonna happen. Personally I’ll never believe another word that comes out of Lutz’ maw and I like to see his retirement come with him falling into an open manhole. In China.
If you want to support the troops, how about Ford? Mullaly (Mulally? Whatever, damn Irish…) has taken decent strides in developing alt-drive vehicles, battery development, and infrastructure. You can feel he wants to keep the Ford name front and center and sees clearly where the industry is heading. Whether cheap gas is around for 1 year or a hundred years, he knows people WANT those hybrids and EV’s. And it’s only good business to give/sell the crowd what they want.
Chrysler? A dead duck. That company is about as useful as a dead toad these days. Too bad, too, since they had decent product. But their management is stuck in 1955 and will soon see the error of their ways.
Beside those, hope for the Toyotas, Hondas, and BYDs who will have plants in this country to build cars in this country. It’s a global market after all, isn’t it? Buy a car built in this country but the profits go overseas, or buy a car built overseas with parts made by American companies? Or Mexican companies, for that matter. And so much for that.
I guess my point to all this, Nick, is I respect what you do as a reporter/journalist. You have good instincts for the most part, but I believe your proximity to GM puts you a little too close for objectivity. Next time they invite you in for a “private conference”, pass, and tell them to send you the notes. Then, compare what they say with what happens.
Now get over to Ford and tell Mullaly to get off his ass on that Transit and start delivering the fuckers already. Ciao.
Douglas,
What’s funny is that you and I mostly agree on these things. We’ve written countless times on the pages of gas 2.0 about the tentativeness surrounding the survival of both Chrysler and GM. We’ve also written a lot about how strong Ford is and how solid their next gen car plan is. Certainly GM has pulled off some doozies in the past, and those can’t be forgotten. But when I write about the Volt, I’m just writing what I’ve witnessed first hand. In all honesty, I have way more connections with Ford and Nissan than I do with GM. Hell, I can’t even get GM to return my calls and emails half the time! They haven’t even let me personally drive their precious Volt yet (although others at gas 2.0 have). Ford, on the other hand, has gone out of their way to get me involved. Same with Nissan. If anything, that extra level of attention has made me more aware of how I cover those companies… more objective because I’m trying harder to remain unbiased because of the perceived coziness. GM? They apparently could give a rat’s ass about gas 2.0. I’m going to the NY Auto Show in two weeks and I’ve been trying hard to finally get some time behind the wheel of the Volt there, but so far all I hear are crickets.
So, in actuality I have no, nada, zero “coziness” with GM at the moment. There are no “private conferences,” not even with the manufacturers I do have relationships with! I do, on the other hand, have what could be perceived as a coziness with Nissan and Ford. I’ll readily admit that. I’ve got nothing to hide there. And if I end up showing my colors for a particular brand over another, it will have nothing to do with how responsive each company has been and everything to do with the actual products themselves.
As you’ve demonstrated, the perception out there among regular people about how this whole thing works is that there is some kind of back room dealing going on. Everybody has some kind of conspiracy theory and the world seems to work in these dark and mysterious ways. I can tell you, having worked in both government and in journalism it just doesn’t work that way. Maybe I’m doing it wrong and I should find myself a smoke-filled back room somewhere, but in my experience “private conferences” just don’t happen.
Douglas,
What’s funny is that you and I mostly agree on these things. We’ve written countless times on the pages of gas 2.0 about the tentativeness surrounding the survival of both Chrysler and GM. We’ve also written a lot about how strong Ford is and how solid their next gen car plan is. Certainly GM has pulled off some doozies in the past, and those can’t be forgotten. But when I write about the Volt, I’m just writing what I’ve witnessed first hand. In all honesty, I have way more connections with Ford and Nissan than I do with GM. Hell, I can’t even get GM to return my calls and emails half the time! They haven’t even let me personally drive their precious Volt yet (although others at gas 2.0 have). Ford, on the other hand, has gone out of their way to get me involved. Same with Nissan. If anything, that extra level of attention has made me more aware of how I cover those companies… more objective because I’m trying harder to remain unbiased because of the perceived coziness. GM? They apparently could give a rat’s ass about gas 2.0. I’m going to the NY Auto Show in two weeks and I’ve been trying hard to finally get some time behind the wheel of the Volt there, but so far all I hear are crickets.
So, in actuality I have no, nada, zero “coziness” with GM at the moment. There are no “private conferences,” not even with the manufacturers I do have relationships with! I do, on the other hand, have what could be perceived as a coziness with Nissan and Ford. I’ll readily admit that. I’ve got nothing to hide there. And if I end up showing my colors for a particular brand over another, it will have nothing to do with how responsive each company has been and everything to do with the actual products themselves.
As you’ve demonstrated, the perception out there among regular people about how this whole thing works is that there is some kind of back room dealing going on. Everybody has some kind of conspiracy theory and the world seems to work in these dark and mysterious ways. I can tell you, having worked in both government and in journalism it just doesn’t work that way. Maybe I’m doing it wrong and I should find myself a smoke-filled back room somewhere, but in my experience “private conferences” just don’t happen.
Nick – My apologies at the tone of my note. I guess it came across a little strong. I certainly don’t “think every other person on the face of the planet who thinks the Volt is cool and has great potential to be a success is stupid”. Quite the contrary, I’m enormously in favor of EV’s and EV technology.
It’s GM I have the problem with. Those blowhards have been shouting the “Look, We’re Green!” chant so often and so long now, it’s become tinnitus. Every time they bellow from the mountain top that the Volt Has Arrived, they turn around and pop that balloon with another battery of tests or another upgrade that needs done, so the deployment gets pushed off another 3 months, 6 months, a year, whatever. In the meanwhile they continue to churn out the gas suckers, plead like whiny tarts for more money from congress, and see the top minds of their Great Big Green Tech departments flee like rats from a sinking ship. It sure as hell feels like they’ve been talking up the Volt for 6 or 7 years. And so much for that.
I know you’ve been reporting on the EV scene for quite some time, Nick, and I won’t deny you may have an “insider” access the rest of us don’t. But perhaps that coziness with GM’s suits has dulled your edging on reporting on their company. We all would like to have the US auto industry return to it’s glory days, but realistically it’s just no gonna happen. Personally I’ll never believe another word that comes out of Lutz’ maw and I like to see his retirement come with him falling into an open manhole. In China.
If you want to support the troops, how about Ford? Mullaly (Mulally? Whatever, damn Irish…) has taken decent strides in developing alt-drive vehicles, battery development, and infrastructure. You can feel he wants to keep the Ford name front and center and sees clearly where the industry is heading. Whether cheap gas is around for 1 year or a hundred years, he knows people WANT those hybrids and EV’s. And it’s only good business to give/sell the crowd what they want.
Chrysler? A dead duck. That company is about as useful as a dead toad these days. Too bad, too, since they had decent product. But their management is stuck in 1955 and will soon see the error of their ways.
Beside those, hope for the Toyotas, Hondas, and BYDs who will have plants in this country to build cars in this country. It’s a global market after all, isn’t it? Buy a car built in this country but the profits go overseas, or buy a car built overseas with parts made by American companies? Or Mexican companies, for that matter. And so much for that.
I guess my point to all this, Nick, is I respect what you do as a reporter/journalist. You have good instincts for the most part, but I believe your proximity to GM puts you a little too close for objectivity. Next time they invite you in for a “private conference”, pass, and tell them to send you the notes. Then, compare what they say with what happens.
Now get over to Ford and tell Mullaly to get off his ass on that Transit and start delivering the fuckers already. Ciao.
Nick – My apologies at the tone of my note. I guess it came across a little strong. I certainly don’t “think every other person on the face of the planet who thinks the Volt is cool and has great potential to be a success is stupid”. Quite the contrary, I’m enormously in favor of EV’s and EV technology.
It’s GM I have the problem with. Those blowhards have been shouting the “Look, We’re Green!” chant so often and so long now, it’s become tinnitus. Every time they bellow from the mountain top that the Volt Has Arrived, they turn around and pop that balloon with another battery of tests or another upgrade that needs done, so the deployment gets pushed off another 3 months, 6 months, a year, whatever. In the meanwhile they continue to churn out the gas suckers, plead like whiny tarts for more money from congress, and see the top minds of their Great Big Green Tech departments flee like rats from a sinking ship. It sure as hell feels like they’ve been talking up the Volt for 6 or 7 years. And so much for that.
I know you’ve been reporting on the EV scene for quite some time, Nick, and I won’t deny you may have an “insider” access the rest of us don’t. But perhaps that coziness with GM’s suits has dulled your edging on reporting on their company. We all would like to have the US auto industry return to it’s glory days, but realistically it’s just no gonna happen. Personally I’ll never believe another word that comes out of Lutz’ maw and I like to see his retirement come with him falling into an open manhole. In China.
If you want to support the troops, how about Ford? Mullaly (Mulally? Whatever, damn Irish…) has taken decent strides in developing alt-drive vehicles, battery development, and infrastructure. You can feel he wants to keep the Ford name front and center and sees clearly where the industry is heading. Whether cheap gas is around for 1 year or a hundred years, he knows people WANT those hybrids and EV’s. And it’s only good business to give/sell the crowd what they want.
Chrysler? A dead duck. That company is about as useful as a dead toad these days. Too bad, too, since they had decent product. But their management is stuck in 1955 and will soon see the error of their ways.
Beside those, hope for the Toyotas, Hondas, and BYDs who will have plants in this country to build cars in this country. It’s a global market after all, isn’t it? Buy a car built in this country but the profits go overseas, or buy a car built overseas with parts made by American companies? Or Mexican companies, for that matter. And so much for that.
I guess my point to all this, Nick, is I respect what you do as a reporter/journalist. You have good instincts for the most part, but I believe your proximity to GM puts you a little too close for objectivity. Next time they invite you in for a “private conference”, pass, and tell them to send you the notes. Then, compare what they say with what happens.
Now get over to Ford and tell Mullaly to get off his ass on that Transit and start delivering the fuckers already. Ciao.
Douglas,
What’s funny is that you and I mostly agree on these things. We’ve written countless times on the pages of gas 2.0 about the tentativeness surrounding the survival of both Chrysler and GM. We’ve also written a lot about how strong Ford is and how solid their next gen car plan is. Certainly GM has pulled off some doozies in the past, and those can’t be forgotten. But when I write about the Volt, I’m just writing what I’ve witnessed first hand. In all honesty, I have way more connections with Ford and Nissan than I do with GM. Hell, I can’t even get GM to return my calls and emails half the time! They haven’t even let me personally drive their precious Volt yet (although others at gas 2.0 have). Ford, on the other hand, has gone out of their way to get me involved. Same with Nissan. If anything, that extra level of attention has made me more aware of how I cover those companies… more objective because I’m trying harder to remain unbiased because of the perceived coziness. GM? They apparently could give a rat’s ass about gas 2.0. I’m going to the NY Auto Show in two weeks and I’ve been trying hard to finally get some time behind the wheel of the Volt there, but so far all I hear are crickets.
So, in actuality I have no, nada, zero “coziness” with GM at the moment. There are no “private conferences,” not even with the manufacturers I do have relationships with! I do, on the other hand, have what could be perceived as a coziness with Nissan and Ford. I’ll readily admit that. I’ve got nothing to hide there. And if I end up showing my colors for a particular brand over another, it will have nothing to do with how responsive each company has been and everything to do with the actual products themselves.
As you’ve demonstrated, the perception out there among regular people about how this whole thing works is that there is some kind of back room dealing going on. Everybody has some kind of conspiracy theory and the world seems to work in these dark and mysterious ways. I can tell you, having worked in both government and in journalism it just doesn’t work that way. Maybe I’m doing it wrong and I should find myself a smoke-filled back room somewhere, but in my experience “private conferences” just don’t happen.
Nick – Thanks for clearing that up. My bad on the misperception of your relationship with GM. Maybe just bad bleed-back on my side from all the other bile GM spews out on a daily basis. (Jesus, there’s a lot of b’s in that sentence.)
It’s too bad you don’t get those “private conferences”. You should. In fact, you should insist upon it, if not in the spirit of journalism, then in the spirit of getting something for nothing. Drink all their booze and call their wives whores. And if they refuse to let you in, tell them the next article will describe how their new hybrids run on a combination of chicken shit and fresh urine. Tell them you’re writing for the London Times now and all the Arabs love your work. Fuck ‘em. Tell them you’re marrying an Arab princess in Dubai and Daddy is buying Chrysler as a wedding gift. Scare the fuckers with the vision of an ad campaign of people pulling over to the side of the road and pissing in the gas tank. “Gotta get to work, honey. Gimme another cup o’ joe!” Special attachments for the ladies and a funnel in the back seat for junior.
Well, it’s a thought. Ciao.
Nick – Thanks for clearing that up. My bad on the misperception of your relationship with GM. Maybe just bad bleed-back on my side from all the other bile GM spews out on a daily basis. (Jesus, there’s a lot of b’s in that sentence.)
It’s too bad you don’t get those “private conferences”. You should. In fact, you should insist upon it, if not in the spirit of journalism, then in the spirit of getting something for nothing. Drink all their booze and call their wives whores. And if they refuse to let you in, tell them the next article will describe how their new hybrids run on a combination of chicken shit and fresh urine. Tell them you’re writing for the London Times now and all the Arabs love your work. Fuck ‘em. Tell them you’re marrying an Arab princess in Dubai and Daddy is buying Chrysler as a wedding gift. Scare the fuckers with the vision of an ad campaign of people pulling over to the side of the road and pissing in the gas tank. “Gotta get to work, honey. Gimme another cup o’ joe!” Special attachments for the ladies and a funnel in the back seat for junior.
Well, it’s a thought. Ciao.
Prince , stop being such a tool already.
Prince , stop being such a tool already.
Prince , stop being such a tool already.
Oh, okay.
Oh, okay.