It has been awhile since we talked about hydrogen cars. In fact, auto manufacturers the world over seem to have pushed hydrogen vehicles to the side of their plate (next to the spinach and garbanzo beans). There are of course exceptions, such as Mazda and Mercedes, but electric cars are all the rage right now, and hydrogen arguably has more infrastructure issues to overcome. The biggest issue; where does one get hydrogen?
A Connecticut company called SunHydro wants to deploy 11 solar-powered hydrogen fueling stations (SunHydro, get it?) along the East Coast, creating the area’s first hydrogen highway.
Using electrolysis technology from Proton Energy, based in Wallingford, CT, (one town over from me!) SunHydro wants to deploy stations from Portland, Maine to the southern tip of Florida. The stations will be small time, though completely self-contained, and will be able to fill just ten-to-fifteen cars per day. That doesn’t leave a whole lot of room for profit, but hydrogen cars are faced with the “chicken or egg” quandry.
What comes first? Hydrogen cars, or hydrogen filling stations? SunHydro seems to think the filling stations need to come first. Since the whole process uses just the sun to split hydrogen atoms, it is relatively cheap compared to other methods of building hydrogen fueling stations. Of course, “relatively” still means $3 million to install just one station.
Still, the East Coast does have an advantage over California in terms of building a hydrogen highway. 14 states touch the Atlantic, compared to three on the West Coast, which means getting public funding or assistance would likely be easier (though it might not). The hydrogen highway would also run through Washington D.C., though the closest station would be in Richmond, VA, giving the Feds a reason to pitch in.
But if you build it, they will come. Right?
Source: Wired | Image: Honda FCX Clarity Hydrogen Car
PDF 
About Christopher DeMorro
Well, SunHydro might be right about the stations needing to come first. But, *when* will we see enough hydrogen powered cars for this to be plausible? Seeing as the FCX Clarity costs around $2,000,000 a copy (or $800/month lease), and a few other companies talking about hydrogen powered cars *sometime* in the future — how many will we actually see here on the east coast in say the next 10-25 years?
My guess is near zero.
And they want to build 11 of these stations between Portland ME and the Keys? That’s 1,670 miles from Key Largo to Portland, so that’s ~167 miles between them — only very short side trips!
They are estimating each station will cost $3,000,000 to install and service 10-15 cars per day. If you count a EV charging station’s cost at $10,000 and it can charge 4-6 cars a day, that means you could service the same number of cars for $30,000 — or 1/100th the cost! For the cost of just one hydrogen filling station, you could instead install 300 EV charging stations and service 1,200-1,800 cars per day at just 1/11th the cost.
Oh yeah, this hydrogen thing makes a great business model…
Sincerely, Neil
Well, SunHydro might be right about the stations needing to come first. But, *when* will we see enough hydrogen powered cars for this to be plausible? Seeing as the FCX Clarity costs around $2,000,000 a copy (or $800/month lease), and a few other companies talking about hydrogen powered cars *sometime* in the future — how many will we actually see here on the east coast in say the next 10-25 years?
My guess is near zero.
And they want to build 11 of these stations between Portland ME and the Keys? That’s 1,670 miles from Key Largo to Portland, so that’s ~167 miles between them — only very short side trips!
They are estimating each station will cost $3,000,000 to install and service 10-15 cars per day. If you count a EV charging station’s cost at $10,000 and it can charge 4-6 cars a day, that means you could service the same number of cars for $30,000 — or 1/100th the cost! For the cost of just one hydrogen filling station, you could instead install 300 EV charging stations and service 1,200-1,800 cars per day at just 1/11th the cost.
Oh yeah, this hydrogen thing makes a great business model…
Sincerely, Neil
Well, SunHydro might be right about the stations needing to come first. But, *when* will we see enough hydrogen powered cars for this to be plausible? Seeing as the FCX Clarity costs around $2,000,000 a copy (or $800/month lease), and a few other companies talking about hydrogen powered cars *sometime* in the future — how many will we actually see here on the east coast in say the next 10-25 years?
My guess is near zero.
And they want to build 11 of these stations between Portland ME and the Keys? That’s 1,670 miles from Key Largo to Portland, so that’s ~167 miles between them — only very short side trips!
They are estimating each station will cost $3,000,000 to install and service 10-15 cars per day. If you count a EV charging station’s cost at $10,000 and it can charge 4-6 cars a day, that means you could service the same number of cars for $30,000 — or 1/100th the cost! For the cost of just one hydrogen filling station, you could instead install 300 EV charging stations and service 1,200-1,800 cars per day at just 1/11th the cost.
Oh yeah, this hydrogen thing makes a great business model…
Sincerely, Neil
Well, SunHydro might be right about the stations needing to come first. But, *when* will we see enough hydrogen powered cars for this to be plausible? Seeing as the FCX Clarity costs around $2,000,000 a copy (or $800/month lease), and a few other companies talking about hydrogen powered cars *sometime* in the future — how many will we actually see here on the east coast in say the next 10-25 years?
My guess is near zero.
And they want to build 11 of these stations between Portland ME and the Keys? That’s 1,670 miles from Key Largo to Portland, so that’s ~167 miles between them — only very short side trips!
They are estimating each station will cost $3,000,000 to install and service 10-15 cars per day. If you count a EV charging station’s cost at $10,000 and it can charge 4-6 cars a day, that means you could service the same number of cars for $30,000 — or 1/100th the cost! For the cost of just one hydrogen filling station, you could instead install 300 EV charging stations and service 1,200-1,800 cars per day at just 1/11th the cost.
Oh yeah, this hydrogen thing makes a great business model…
Sincerely, Neil
Neil, just to clarify. Are you comparing like with like here?
The SunHydro refuelling stations seem to produce some or all of their own electricity from photovoltaics.
Does the cost you cite for a BEV recharging station include the capital cost for generating renewable electricity?
Neil, just to clarify. Are you comparing like with like here?
The SunHydro refuelling stations seem to produce some or all of their own electricity from photovoltaics.
Does the cost you cite for a BEV recharging station include the capital cost for generating renewable electricity?
Hi John,
Fair enough — I was comparing equal costs. But, I also know that it takes approximately 3X as much electricity to make hydrogen as you get out of it, so, each of these stations could charge 30-45 cars per day. Still a lot better than if you make hydrogen, but not as big of a difference.
Of course, I think there are already more EV’s on the road, than we will ever see for hydrogen cars. And why is that, do you think?
Neil
Hi John,
Fair enough — I was comparing equal costs. But, I also know that it takes approximately 3X as much electricity to make hydrogen as you get out of it, so, each of these stations could charge 30-45 cars per day. Still a lot better than if you make hydrogen, but not as big of a difference.
Of course, I think there are already more EV’s on the road, than we will ever see for hydrogen cars. And why is that, do you think?
Neil
Thank you Neil
As Professor David MacKay* might put it:
Please don’t get me wrong: I’m not trying to be pro-hydrogen. I’m just pro-arithmetic.
* http://www.withouthotair.com p129
Thank you Neil
As Professor David MacKay* might put it:
Please don’t get me wrong: I’m not trying to be pro-hydrogen. I’m just pro-arithmetic.
* http://www.withouthotair.com p129
Thank you Neil
As Professor David MacKay* might put it:
Please don’t get me wrong: I’m not trying to be pro-hydrogen. I’m just pro-arithmetic.
* http://www.withouthotair.com p129
Thank you Neil
As Professor David MacKay* might put it:
Please don’t get me wrong: I’m not trying to be pro-hydrogen. I’m just pro-arithmetic.
* http://www.withouthotair.com p129
There are propane conversions available for gasoline engines. Why would we not produce conversions for hydrgen instead of propane?
That should easily solve the customer problem. There would be no reason to delete the gasoline capability of the vehicle when adding the hydrogen capability, thus providing true dual fuel capability.
There are propane conversions available for gasoline engines. Why would we not produce conversions for hydrgen instead of propane?
That should easily solve the customer problem. There would be no reason to delete the gasoline capability of the vehicle when adding the hydrogen capability, thus providing true dual fuel capability.
ChuckL, what you have described is the BMW Hydrogen 7, which is dual fuel hydrogen and gasoline internal combustion engined car.
According to Prof. MacKay*: ‘Fuelling the Hydrogen 7, the hydrogen-powered car made by BMW, requires 254 kWh per 100 km – 220% more energy than an average European car.’
But, because of its use of gasoline, it is not dependent on hydrogen filling stations, so most of the time it drives around as a rather complex and heavy, rather expensive, gasoline-powered saloon.
(* http://www.withouthotair.com p130 or http://www.inference.phy.cam.ac.uk/withouthotair/c20/page_130.shtml)
ChuckL, what you have described is the BMW Hydrogen 7, which is dual fuel hydrogen and gasoline internal combustion engined car.
According to Prof. MacKay*: ‘Fuelling the Hydrogen 7, the hydrogen-powered car made by BMW, requires 254 kWh per 100 km – 220% more energy than an average European car.’
But, because of its use of gasoline, it is not dependent on hydrogen filling stations, so most of the time it drives around as a rather complex and heavy, rather expensive, gasoline-powered saloon.
(* http://www.withouthotair.com p130 or http://www.inference.phy.cam.ac.uk/withouthotair/c20/page_130.shtml)
ChuckL, what you have described is the BMW Hydrogen 7, which is dual fuel hydrogen and gasoline internal combustion engined car.
According to Prof. MacKay*: ‘Fuelling the Hydrogen 7, the hydrogen-powered car made by BMW, requires 254 kWh per 100 km – 220% more energy than an average European car.’
But, because of its use of gasoline, it is not dependent on hydrogen filling stations, so most of the time it drives around as a rather complex and heavy, rather expensive, gasoline-powered saloon.
(* http://www.withouthotair.com p130 or http://www.inference.phy.cam.ac.uk/withouthotair/c20/page_130.shtml)
ChuckL, what you have described is the BMW Hydrogen 7, which is dual fuel hydrogen and gasoline internal combustion engined car.
According to Prof. MacKay*: ‘Fuelling the Hydrogen 7, the hydrogen-powered car made by BMW, requires 254 kWh per 100 km – 220% more energy than an average European car.’
But, because of its use of gasoline, it is not dependent on hydrogen filling stations, so most of the time it drives around as a rather complex and heavy, rather expensive, gasoline-powered saloon.
(* http://www.withouthotair.com p130 or http://www.inference.phy.cam.ac.uk/withouthotair/c20/page_130.shtml)
So spend $33,000,000 to build 11 stations that can only fuel a dozen cars a day? Wow. For that same amount, we could install our on demand hydrogen systems on 33,000 cars, and have people immediately saving 40% on their fuel costs while dropping emissions, AND the consumers could use their existing vehicles instead of shelling out $500,000 for a ceramic coated engine.
Waste of money to build these stations, but since it’s so impractical and makes no business sense- they will probably get government funding…
We will continue to develop and sell practical hydrogen systems for our customers…
Bob,
Sorry to say it, but you’re a snake oil salesman. HHO kits are complete bunk. Normally I’d moderate this comment as pure spam, but I thought I’d let it get through so that I could warn off any potential customers from falling into the trap.
Bob,
Sorry to say it, but you’re a snake oil salesman. HHO kits are complete bunk. Normally I’d moderate this comment as pure spam, but I thought I’d let it get through so that I could warn off any potential customers from falling into the trap.
Bob,
Sorry to say it, but you’re a snake oil salesman. HHO kits are complete bunk. Normally I’d moderate this comment as pure spam, but I thought I’d let it get through so that I could warn off any potential customers from falling into the trap.
So spend $33,000,000 to build 11 stations that can only fuel a dozen cars a day? Wow. For that same amount, we could install our on demand hydrogen systems on 33,000 cars, and have people immediately saving 40% on their fuel costs while dropping emissions, AND the consumers could use their existing vehicles instead of shelling out $500,000 for a ceramic coated engine.
Waste of money to build these stations, but since it’s so impractical and makes no business sense- they will probably get government funding…
We will continue to develop and sell practical hydrogen systems for our customers…
Bob,
Sorry to say it, but you’re a snake oil salesman. HHO kits are complete bunk. Normally I’d moderate this comment as pure spam, but I thought I’d let it get through so that I could warn off any potential customers from falling into the trap.