Two interesting events took place last week in the electric vehicle industry: GM invited several journalists to take a ride in the Chevy Volt, and Tesla Motors’ CEO Elon Musk appeared on David Letterman. Despite appearances, these two events are tied together. Why? Because as GM continues to tout the Volt’s ability to get 40 miles per charge and that a driver can go weeks without using gasoline, the Tesla Roadster gets more than 100 miles per charge and never uses a drop of gas.
What’s so great about 40 miles per charge? The Volt’s technology will be outdated before it even hits the market in 2010.
As a matter of fact, David Letterman asked that very same question to Musk who has been vocal about his dislike of plug-in hybrids like the Volt. “The Volt has a range of 40 miles….that’s ridiculous…Oh Boy, we have the electric car at 40 miles per charge. That’s crap,” said Letterman.
Musk stated that he thought the major autos would develop and market great electric car technology and he hoped that he wouldn’t have to do it himself — but he did. And it appears that if Americans are going to be offered cutting-edge electric technologies, then it looks like we’ll need more independent companies to follow in the footsteps of Tesla.
Here are three reasons why the current market favors independent auto companies.
1. The Big Three American auto companies are so out of touch with consumer trends by the time they bring new technologies to market, they have already lost market share. For example, Chevrolet didn’t bring the EV1 to market because they believed there was no market for the vehicle. Yet the Toyota Prius is about to hit the million mark in sales in the U.S. Slightly different technologies but same concept. Toyota and Honda own the market for hybrids.
2. The major auto companies work so slow that by the time they do bring new technologies to market, they are outdated. For example, the Tesla Roadster already out performs the Chevy Volt on miles per charge and the Volt has yet to be offered to consumers.
3. The Big Three autos have too much debt and not enough agility. The recently formed company Bright Automotive was able to bring The IDEA, a hybrid light truck to market in less than one year with more advanced technology. It takes the large American auto companies decades to develop and market new technologies.
As Letterman aluded to, our country can’t wait on The Big Three. I agree. The time is right for new, innovative auto companies to lead the way to better EV technologies.
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That’s great that Tesla Motors’ vehicle is capable of 100 miles per charge. How about making one that’s affordable for the average consumer and doesn’t cost $100,000.00 plus. If you’re going to slam GM, put your money where you mouth is and produce a vehicle in the same price range!!!
That’s great that Tesla Motors’ vehicle is capable of 100 miles per charge. How about making one that’s affordable for the average consumer and doesn’t cost $100,000.00 plus. If you’re going to slam GM, put your money where you mouth is and produce a vehicle in the same price range!!!
The Tesla Roadster costs $100K and only seats 2! What are you talking about it out-performs the Volt? I’m not Volt shill, but that statement is incredibly… false.
The Tesla Roadster costs $100K and only seats 2! What are you talking about it out-performs the Volt? I’m not Volt shill, but that statement is incredibly… false.
We aren’t talking about the $100K roaster. The sedan is cheaper and is competitive with BMWs and Mercedes in form for price. No, we aren’t talking about competing in price with the prius, but the Volt by everyone’s estimates is going to be a $40-50K car – only $10K cheaper than the Tesla Sedan which is ALL electric.
Face it. GM and Ford are the only ones playing in the electric game with any chance and they are behind both Tesla and Fisker in capabilities. “Crysler” has very little to show for them selves except a Lotus that they contracted to look like a viper.
We aren’t talking about the $100K roaster. The sedan is cheaper and is competitive with BMWs and Mercedes in form for price. No, we aren’t talking about competing in price with the prius, but the Volt by everyone’s estimates is going to be a $40-50K car – only $10K cheaper than the Tesla Sedan which is ALL electric.
Face it. GM and Ford are the only ones playing in the electric game with any chance and they are behind both Tesla and Fisker in capabilities. “Crysler” has very little to show for them selves except a Lotus that they contracted to look like a viper.
The Tesla Roadster (2 passenger) is capable of 244 miles per charge (according to Tesla). The upcoming Tesla S (7 passenger) can be optioned to go 160, 230, or 300 miles per charge starting at around $50K (after tax rebate). The Volt will go 40 miles before continuing to fund terrorism….uh, I mean use gas.
The great thing about the Roadster is: it EXISTS! The other two are still ‘in development’. GM seems so proud of their Volt, when, as far as everyone that has experienced it knows, it only exists as a 40 mile range electric car.
GM could fix their image problem: they could have put out an EV-2 RIGHT NOW. I’m sure that they didn’t crush all of the plans and research from the EV-1 project along with the cars. They have the knowledge, they have the technology, they have an idle workforce. I don’t see any reason why GM couldn’t put out a true Electric Vehicle in a short span of time….hell, they could leave out the terrorist funder….I mean gas engine…and put in battery packs to extend their range…but that bit of common sense seems to slip past them for some unknown reason.
Give it time: China will leapfrog over us in terms of automotive prowess. They are investing heavily in electric vehicles and technology and before you know it, they’ll open up a China Motors right here in the US!
The Tesla Roadster (2 passenger) is capable of 244 miles per charge (according to Tesla). The upcoming Tesla S (7 passenger) can be optioned to go 160, 230, or 300 miles per charge starting at around $50K (after tax rebate). The Volt will go 40 miles before continuing to fund terrorism….uh, I mean use gas.
The great thing about the Roadster is: it EXISTS! The other two are still ‘in development’. GM seems so proud of their Volt, when, as far as everyone that has experienced it knows, it only exists as a 40 mile range electric car.
GM could fix their image problem: they could have put out an EV-2 RIGHT NOW. I’m sure that they didn’t crush all of the plans and research from the EV-1 project along with the cars. They have the knowledge, they have the technology, they have an idle workforce. I don’t see any reason why GM couldn’t put out a true Electric Vehicle in a short span of time….hell, they could leave out the terrorist funder….I mean gas engine…and put in battery packs to extend their range…but that bit of common sense seems to slip past them for some unknown reason.
Give it time: China will leapfrog over us in terms of automotive prowess. They are investing heavily in electric vehicles and technology and before you know it, they’ll open up a China Motors right here in the US!
Anyone who believes that the Prius is “the same technology” as the EV-1 needs to either go out and learn something about her subject matter, or find something else to write about. This article is downright embarrassing – it would take far too long to point out each and every idiocy it contains. Unbleievable arrogance to think one understands what one obviously does not.
Anyone who believes that the Prius is “the same technology” as the EV-1 needs to either go out and learn something about her subject matter, or find something else to write about. This article is downright embarrassing – it would take far too long to point out each and every idiocy it contains. Unbleievable arrogance to think one understands what one obviously does not.
I think my favorite part of this post is linking to an article with the headline “Volt Beats Tesla: Series and Plug-In Hybrids More Likely to be Game Changers” while trying to prove the opposite.
A few quick clarifications:
1) 80 percent of Americans drive less than 40 miles per day, so most Chevy Volt drivers will drive gas-free
2) When the Volt’s electric range ends, the range extender kicks-in to power the vehicle electrically for several hundred more miles and you can fill-up with fuel to travel several hundred more if necessary instead of waiting for your vehicle to recharge
3) The EV1 was a pure battery electric vehicle and the Prius is a hybrid-electric vehicle – very different technologies, not “slightly different”
4) The EV1 was brought to market and leased on the west coast – market demand dictated the production stoppage
5) Hybrids are purposeful vehicles and we offer eight of them for consumers to choose, but the market for hybrids is still only 2-3 percent of the total vehicle market and sales of hybrids were down nearly 10 percent in 2008
I will also ask two relevant questions, how many of these companies are mass-producing electric vehicles currently, and how many Tesla vehicle orders have been filled?
Someone may want to look the answers to those up and do the research for this post that should have been done in the first place.
“The time is right for new, innovative auto companies to lead the way to better EV technologies.”
I couldn’t agree more and I’m proud to be part of a company that is changing the way we drive by offering an electric vehicle for mass-production with no excuses or limitations to a person’s driving habits.
And finally, if you haven’t seen it already, here is our response to Letterman and our invitation for him to come and experience the Volt:
http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/archives/2009/05/stupid_human_trick.html
I think my favorite part of this post is linking to an article with the headline “Volt Beats Tesla: Series and Plug-In Hybrids More Likely to be Game Changers” while trying to prove the opposite.
A few quick clarifications:
1) 80 percent of Americans drive less than 40 miles per day, so most Chevy Volt drivers will drive gas-free
2) When the Volt’s electric range ends, the range extender kicks-in to power the vehicle electrically for several hundred more miles and you can fill-up with fuel to travel several hundred more if necessary instead of waiting for your vehicle to recharge
3) The EV1 was a pure battery electric vehicle and the Prius is a hybrid-electric vehicle – very different technologies, not “slightly different”
4) The EV1 was brought to market and leased on the west coast – market demand dictated the production stoppage
5) Hybrids are purposeful vehicles and we offer eight of them for consumers to choose, but the market for hybrids is still only 2-3 percent of the total vehicle market and sales of hybrids were down nearly 10 percent in 2008
I will also ask two relevant questions, how many of these companies are mass-producing electric vehicles currently, and how many Tesla vehicle orders have been filled?
Someone may want to look the answers to those up and do the research for this post that should have been done in the first place.
“The time is right for new, innovative auto companies to lead the way to better EV technologies.”
I couldn’t agree more and I’m proud to be part of a company that is changing the way we drive by offering an electric vehicle for mass-production with no excuses or limitations to a person’s driving habits.
And finally, if you haven’t seen it already, here is our response to Letterman and our invitation for him to come and experience the Volt:
http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/archives/2009/05/stupid_human_trick.html
And the author values Letterman’s opinion because…?
Seriously though, I just want to address a few of the points made in this article.
…”Chevrolet didn’t bring the EV1 to market because they believed there was no market for the vehicle. Yet the Toyota Prius is about to hit the million mark in sales in the U.S. Slightly different technologies but same concept…”
Sorry, the technologies are much different. Besides, the Prius can be driven anywhere there are gas stations. That’s a pretty important difference.
…”the Tesla Roadster already out performs the Chevy Volt on miles per charge and the Volt has yet to be offered to consumers.”
Ummm… the Roadster had better get more miles per charge.
…”It takes the large American auto companies decades to develop and market new technologies.”
Decades! Really? Beyond the ignorance of this statement let me just point out that A)Electric motors were invented a long time ago and B)The car companies aren’t necessarily developing the battery technology.
And the author values Letterman’s opinion because…?
Seriously though, I just want to address a few of the points made in this article.
…”Chevrolet didn’t bring the EV1 to market because they believed there was no market for the vehicle. Yet the Toyota Prius is about to hit the million mark in sales in the U.S. Slightly different technologies but same concept…”
Sorry, the technologies are much different. Besides, the Prius can be driven anywhere there are gas stations. That’s a pretty important difference.
…”the Tesla Roadster already out performs the Chevy Volt on miles per charge and the Volt has yet to be offered to consumers.”
Ummm… the Roadster had better get more miles per charge.
…”It takes the large American auto companies decades to develop and market new technologies.”
Decades! Really? Beyond the ignorance of this statement let me just point out that A)Electric motors were invented a long time ago and B)The car companies aren’t necessarily developing the battery technology.
Tesla’s approach can never be anything more than a tiny niche with current (or foreseeable future) battery technology. In fact, the Volt is also unrealistically unbalanced in favor of the battery. A much more realistic plug-in hybrid would be a version of the Volt that had maybe a 10 mile battery. That would get the cost way down while still improving gas mileage by a great deal.
The problem with any battery technology is that the energy/weight (and energy/volume) ratios are simply awful compared to hydrocarbons, and that is not going to change in the foreseeable future. Plus, in the case of lithium batteries, the supply of lithium is far too limited to support scaling up to millions of Volts, and certainly not millions of Teslas.
The best solution is plug-in hybrids with much more limited battery capacity with biofuels powering an electric generator. My guess is that this is what Toyota and Honda will end up doing, since they are both focused on balanced, practical designs.
Tesla’s approach can never be anything more than a tiny niche with current (or foreseeable future) battery technology. In fact, the Volt is also unrealistically unbalanced in favor of the battery. A much more realistic plug-in hybrid would be a version of the Volt that had maybe a 10 mile battery. That would get the cost way down while still improving gas mileage by a great deal.
The problem with any battery technology is that the energy/weight (and energy/volume) ratios are simply awful compared to hydrocarbons, and that is not going to change in the foreseeable future. Plus, in the case of lithium batteries, the supply of lithium is far too limited to support scaling up to millions of Volts, and certainly not millions of Teslas.
The best solution is plug-in hybrids with much more limited battery capacity with biofuels powering an electric generator. My guess is that this is what Toyota and Honda will end up doing, since they are both focused on balanced, practical designs.
You all believe Mr. Musk when he says his sedan is going to cost $50K?
Sorry, but the battery pack on a Volt is $20K alone. You’re not going to do a car with 4 times the range for $50K. No way. Elon Musk is flat out lying when he tells us the car will be available in 2011, and flat out lying when he says it will cost $50K. He’s a promoter. He wants people to put down deposits.
The argument that GM is “like so totally yesterday” and therefore they don’t know what they’re doing is willfully ignorant. GM’s got some of the world’s best automotive engineers. And they’re engineering the car to the kind of high standard consumers expect. The Tesla roadster is a cool, but very few consumers would put up with its quirks or its price. It’s good, but it’s still a toy.
Journalists who get their opinions from talk show hosts and corporate promoters (Tesla’s a profit seeking corporation, sorry) who are demonstrably lying do not deserve a platform like this website.
You all believe Mr. Musk when he says his sedan is going to cost $50K?
Sorry, but the battery pack on a Volt is $20K alone. You’re not going to do a car with 4 times the range for $50K. No way. Elon Musk is flat out lying when he tells us the car will be available in 2011, and flat out lying when he says it will cost $50K. He’s a promoter. He wants people to put down deposits.
The argument that GM is “like so totally yesterday” and therefore they don’t know what they’re doing is willfully ignorant. GM’s got some of the world’s best automotive engineers. And they’re engineering the car to the kind of high standard consumers expect. The Tesla roadster is a cool, but very few consumers would put up with its quirks or its price. It’s good, but it’s still a toy.
Journalists who get their opinions from talk show hosts and corporate promoters (Tesla’s a profit seeking corporation, sorry) who are demonstrably lying do not deserve a platform like this website.
Oh my … this article is embarrassing! Is ‘Joanna Schroeder’ by any chance a pen name for ‘Elon Musk’? Vehicles like the Roadster will never be anything but toys for the wealthy. How many of them will just end up collecting dust in the showroom garage while their owners drive around in a fully-loaded Escalade? The people that buy vehicles like this aren’t concerned with warranty coverage or field failures … they can afford it.
Let us also consider that there is but one prototype of the mystical Model-S, nothing close to a commitment on a production date, and a dubious estimate of the final cost. GM, on the other hand, has been developing the Volt in full view of the public and the media. Come the end of 2010, I’d be a lot happier with 40 miles on the Volt’s battery power than zero miles on Musk’s empty promises.
Musk is an arrogant blow-hard. He is a blight on the entire company.
Oh my … this article is embarrassing! Is ‘Joanna Schroeder’ by any chance a pen name for ‘Elon Musk’? Vehicles like the Roadster will never be anything but toys for the wealthy. How many of them will just end up collecting dust in the showroom garage while their owners drive around in a fully-loaded Escalade? The people that buy vehicles like this aren’t concerned with warranty coverage or field failures … they can afford it.
Let us also consider that there is but one prototype of the mystical Model-S, nothing close to a commitment on a production date, and a dubious estimate of the final cost. GM, on the other hand, has been developing the Volt in full view of the public and the media. Come the end of 2010, I’d be a lot happier with 40 miles on the Volt’s battery power than zero miles on Musk’s empty promises.
Musk is an arrogant blow-hard. He is a blight on the entire company.
Letterman is out of touch if he thinks a $100 thousand two seater is his viewers’ idea of a usable vehicle. And while Toyota is known for its hybrid, the new Ford Fusion smokes the Prius in driveability with only slghtly lower mileage and lots of lux. (I don’t even consider the Honda Insight, too small.) David, drive the Ford Fusion hybrid and tell us what you think!
Letterman is out of touch if he thinks a $100 thousand two seater is his viewers’ idea of a usable vehicle. And while Toyota is known for its hybrid, the new Ford Fusion smokes the Prius in driveability with only slghtly lower mileage and lots of lux. (I don’t even consider the Honda Insight, too small.) David, drive the Ford Fusion hybrid and tell us what you think!
Thank you for this article
yes, Letterman is not a car expert, but he brings up good points even if he is not on the mark, and if I were a GM backer, I might have bigger arguments, the same way Republicans fight against Democrats.
There was a recent show I watched ‘Who Killed The Electric Car’. I wish it was never killed, then GM would be on top instead of trying to make up the Volt. Yes, there is limitted capacity for a battery alone, but how many people fill their car up every day? Building batteries in large quantities will bring down the price. And yes, it is widely reported by supposedly reputable people that the Oil and Car companies have been holding back on technowlegies which would make these electric cars work. Car companies have often not made as much money on the sales, a one time amount, but they do make money on maintaining combustion engines and oil companies are enjoying 10 billion dollars in profit each quarter.
How do I know any new cars from the big 3 (2?) will not be canceled when they choose.
I think that what Tesla has is great – a car that is here an now plus a sedan on it’s way. Thank you Elon!
Thank you for this article
yes, Letterman is not a car expert, but he brings up good points even if he is not on the mark, and if I were a GM backer, I might have bigger arguments, the same way Republicans fight against Democrats.
There was a recent show I watched ‘Who Killed The Electric Car’. I wish it was never killed, then GM would be on top instead of trying to make up the Volt. Yes, there is limitted capacity for a battery alone, but how many people fill their car up every day? Building batteries in large quantities will bring down the price. And yes, it is widely reported by supposedly reputable people that the Oil and Car companies have been holding back on technowlegies which would make these electric cars work. Car companies have often not made as much money on the sales, a one time amount, but they do make money on maintaining combustion engines and oil companies are enjoying 10 billion dollars in profit each quarter.
How do I know any new cars from the big 3 (2?) will not be canceled when they choose.
I think that what Tesla has is great – a car that is here an now plus a sedan on it’s way. Thank you Elon!
This article was pathetic. I was a fan of Letterman for years. He was one of the funniest people on tv. In the past decade he has become more and more bitter. Anyone that wants a tesla will have to deal with battery anxiety as was discovered with the EV1. They can travel only so far and that is it before having to recharge. How much time does it take to recharge? If you can recharge at least 50% in 5 miuntes then I would like a pure EV. If it takes 2-12 hours then I am range limited. At least with an extender if I have a long trip I will make it. Most of my driving per day is several miles. Heck I bike it in warm weather. I only have to fill up once every several weeks. Once in a while I do need to travel for work. The volt technology would work for me. In the meantime I will look at the Fusion.
This article was pathetic. I was a fan of Letterman for years. He was one of the funniest people on tv. In the past decade he has become more and more bitter. Anyone that wants a tesla will have to deal with battery anxiety as was discovered with the EV1. They can travel only so far and that is it before having to recharge. How much time does it take to recharge? If you can recharge at least 50% in 5 miuntes then I would like a pure EV. If it takes 2-12 hours then I am range limited. At least with an extender if I have a long trip I will make it. Most of my driving per day is several miles. Heck I bike it in warm weather. I only have to fill up once every several weeks. Once in a while I do need to travel for work. The volt technology would work for me. In the meantime I will look at the Fusion.
@Phil:
“I will also ask two relevant questions, how many of these companies are mass-producing electric vehicles currently, and how many Tesla vehicle orders have been filled?
Someone may want to look the answers to those up and do the research for this post that should have been done in the first place.”
I don’t think there is any reason to be overly defensive about this post, since there are some legitimate, unanswered questions/assumptions about the both Tesla as well as Volt. If you have answers to the specific issues you raise and can point to sources we’d be happy to republish them.
Personally, I’m a big fan of both the Roadster and the Volt, as revolutionary pieces of machinery. That being said, the winner of this race will clearly be the company with the most affordable, attractive, and reliable vehicle. Both of these cars are still out of my price range, as they are for most Americans. If Tesla can sell enough of the Roadsters or sedans to bring the price down, bingo. GM may be getting into the game a bit late, but it still has a chance — if it can get the Volt on the road and build some momentum.
And of course, both companies will face some stiff competition as models from other manufacturers come online. The plug-in Prius comes to mind…?
@Phil:
“I will also ask two relevant questions, how many of these companies are mass-producing electric vehicles currently, and how many Tesla vehicle orders have been filled?
Someone may want to look the answers to those up and do the research for this post that should have been done in the first place.”
I don’t think there is any reason to be overly defensive about this post, since there are some legitimate, unanswered questions/assumptions about the both Tesla as well as Volt. If you have answers to the specific issues you raise and can point to sources we’d be happy to republish them.
Personally, I’m a big fan of both the Roadster and the Volt, as revolutionary pieces of machinery. That being said, the winner of this race will clearly be the company with the most affordable, attractive, and reliable vehicle. Both of these cars are still out of my price range, as they are for most Americans. If Tesla can sell enough of the Roadsters or sedans to bring the price down, bingo. GM may be getting into the game a bit late, but it still has a chance — if it can get the Volt on the road and build some momentum.
And of course, both companies will face some stiff competition as models from other manufacturers come online. The plug-in Prius comes to mind…?
This guy Elon Musk is touting a 50k (base model) sedan for the average consumer? Are you serious? Both he an GM have it all wrong, unlike Honda and Toyota, who are making terrific hybrids that get better and better Mpg’s every year.
The problem with people like this is that they live in a bubble, and have very little understanding as to what the average Joe really needs and can afford for daily commuting or truck hauling. If any U.S. Company is going in the right direction, I’d say it’s Ford with the new hybrid Fusion. They’re a little late to the party, but at least it’s on the dance floor.
This guy Elon Musk is touting a 50k (base model) sedan for the average consumer? Are you serious? Both he an GM have it all wrong, unlike Honda and Toyota, who are making terrific hybrids that get better and better Mpg’s every year.
The problem with people like this is that they live in a bubble, and have very little understanding as to what the average Joe really needs and can afford for daily commuting or truck hauling. If any U.S. Company is going in the right direction, I’d say it’s Ford with the new hybrid Fusion. They’re a little late to the party, but at least it’s on the dance floor.
why didn’t chrysler offer their 1996 CCV (Composite Concept Vehicle) as an electric car?
http://www.carstyling.ru/en/cars.1996_Chrysler_CCV%20(Composite%20Concept%20Vehicle).html
light and cheap. maybe the new owners will?
why didn’t chrysler offer their 1996 CCV (Composite Concept Vehicle) as an electric car?
http://www.carstyling.ru/en/cars.1996_Chrysler_CCV%20(Composite%20Concept%20Vehicle).html
light and cheap. maybe the new owners will?
The electric car is the best, why to even think about hybrid or gas/electric combination ( Volt) ? Is the oil company, governemnt or dealers afraid of loosing gas tax $$ and oil change, filter money? Come on….. we want to see green Earth, and the electric car is the way how to do it!
To GM,
I have been a loyal GM consumer for the past 20 years and there is some truth in what you say. GM can bring the car to mass production, because they have the means to do so. However, given the chance, should TESLA motors bring their product to mass production at reasonable prices, say with a partner such as Daimler who by the way just purchased 10% ownership of TELSA motors, I guarantee they will out sell GM’s product by more than 2 to 1. Because TESLA motors can bring something to the table that the public truly wants, independence from Oil.
To GM,
I have been a loyal GM consumer for the past 20 years and there is some truth in what you say. GM can bring the car to mass production, because they have the means to do so. However, given the chance, should TESLA motors bring their product to mass production at reasonable prices, say with a partner such as Daimler who by the way just purchased 10% ownership of TELSA motors, I guarantee they will out sell GM’s product by more than 2 to 1. Because TESLA motors can bring something to the table that the public truly wants, independence from Oil.